User talk:Raayen

Welcome

Hi Raayen, and Welcome to Wikipedia!

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If you have any questions, feel free to ask me at my talk page — I'm happy to help. Or, you can ask your question at the New contributors' help page.

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MBisanz Good luck, and have fun. --MBisanz ^talk 06:24, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

Re: Abduyi and Davani dialects

I'm excited about the progress of these articles. I made some small changes, relating to their linguistic classification. We could expand the phonology section to give all their sounds, like the Persian article. It might also worth mentioning how (or if) these languages are written, and how it differs from the Persian alphabet (for example, with the ð, ts, and dz sounds). Also, if there are any sources that discuss the history of these languages, this could be included. For example, when and how did they diverge from ancestor languages. The example sentences are great. A sidebar (like the green one in the Persian article) might be nice.

I don't speak these languages, unfortunately, but I would love to help out with these articles in any way I can. Best, –jonsafari (talk) 21:37, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for your reply. Your improvements to these articles are greatly appreciated! Yes, there are undoubtedly many dialects and varieties of Persian, including Dari, Tajiki, as well as Shirazi, Esfahani, Abadani, etc. But linguists usually distinguish two dialects of the same language versus two separate languages using the idea of mutual intelligibility. That is, if a native monolingual speaker of, say, Tehrani could hold a coherent two-way conversation with a native monolingual speaker of, say, Davani (speaking Davani), then these could be considered dialects of the same language. But while it's likely that the Davani could probably understand the Tehrani, it's not likely that the Tehrani would understand a majority of the Davani (speaking Davani).

Yes, there is no clear-cut line between two dialects of the same language and two separate languages. For example a native Portuguese speaker would mostly understand a Spanish speaker, but a Spanish speaker would have much more difficulty understanding the Portuguese speaker.

As far as the articles are concerned, the safest classification is to simply say that they are South West Iranian languages, because saying that is true whether one considers Abduyi and Davani to be dialects of Persian or a separate language group (like SIL and J.R. Payne do). Best, –jonsafari (talk) 20:21, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

It's been great working with you so far, and I look forward to continue working with you to build up these and other articles on dialects of Fars (and maybe even their respective village articles). Please let me know if there are other ways I might be able to help out. –jonsafari (talk) 04:49, 9 July 2008 (UTC)

Carrier language

The Carrier language (and Ahtna and Babine-Witsuwit'en) arenot a Yeniseian language as your recent addition of the implies. They belong to the Na-Dene branch of the Dene-Yeniseian languages. You should include them either in a category called "Endangered Dene-Yeniseian languages" or "Endangered Na-Dené languages".·Maunus·ƛ· 13:30, 3 August 2008 (UTC)

Endangered language categories

Hi! I've noticed your new categories for endangered languages by family, and I think they will be very helpful. However, I'd like to suggest that you add the endangered categories to the category for the respective language family too, as you create them. This should make sure that they are linked in with the language family categories, and that more users will be able to find and use them. Aelfthrytha (talk) 03:05, 20 August 2008 (UTC)

Northern Yukaghir language added to a speedy-delete nommed cat; rmvd from enlang cat

Hi, are you new around here? Why did you add Northern Yukaghir language to a cat that's been speedied? Do you need some help using categories? Ling.Nut ^{(talk—WP:3IAR)} 16:26, 5 September 2008 (UTC)

subcategories of Category:Endangered languages

I think if you create new categories for various language families, then those categories need to be subcategories of the endangered languages category. Don't forget to add any to the parent category, if you create them, OK? Thanks!Ling.Nut ^{(talk—WP:3IAR)} 23:09, 5 September 2008 (UTC)

Cyrus cylinder

FYI, I'm going to be working on an alternate version of the Cyrus cylinder page which would limit all the "reviews" and subjective interpretations of the cylinder (negative or positive) to direct quotes fully attributed to their authors. I'll be making an attempt to replace the sections As a charter of human rights and As an instrument of royal propaganda with a Legacy section. It would be made up of two sub-sections called "proponents" and "critics", containing the various views on the cylinder as direct quotes, while leaving the rest of article to a factual description to give readers a neutral presentation of what the cylinder is, as opposed to what it represents or means -- free of spin or speculation. Feel free to contribute to the temporary page at User:Khoikhoi/Cyrus cylinder. Khoikhoi 00:51, 14 September 2008 (UTC)

Persian people

Hi, you reverted my edits to Persian people saying that the information in the article was not supposed to be exclusive to Iran. Can you please review your edits? The infobox I made had information about Persians in Iran as well as Persians abroad [1]. Could you please consider changing it back? Thanks. Parthian Scribe 03:22, 11 November 2008 (UTC)

Oh, I didn't realize there was previously a discussion about this topic. I apologize. Parthian Scribe 04:34, 11 November 2008 (UTC)

Endangered Salishan languages

Hi Raayen,

I'm wondering, how is the category 'Endangered Salishan languages' any different from 'Salishan languages'? Except for those which are extinct, aren't they identical sets? Couldn't you just add the category 'Salishan languages' to 'Endangered languages'? kwami (talk) 00:34, 16 November 2008 (UTC)

CfD nomination of Category:Endangered Creole languages

Category:Endangered Creole languages, which you created, has been nominated for deletion, merging, or renaming. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the Categories for discussion page. Thank you.

Persian ethnicity

Hey, nice to meet you. In order for us to mention the ethnicity in the opening, we need a citation that it is often confused they are not Persian. But even then, I don't see anything that confusion makes it notable. For example of how we should do biography, please see this. --Enzuru 21:09, 21 November 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for your response. I don't believe the subject means that. Can you please look at the FA and see how many articles mention this? Does Bill Clinton mention he is caucasian? Also, it says it uses those interchangeably, but it doesn't necessarily say it applies the Arab-Islamic label to Persians. I know this was done in the past, but this source is kinda vague about what is happening. Does elsewhere in the book it refer to a Persian as an Arab? How old are the articles included in the book? If so, go ahead and revert me and put that as the Persian citation. (Look at my contributions to see which articles I edited). --Enzuru 21:15, 21 November 2008 (UTC)

Also, we need a source talking about the confusion, not demonstrating that they are ignoring the differences, or technically that would be Original Research on our part. Once we have that source we should be able to do the reverts correctly. --Enzuru 21:16, 21 November 2008 (UTC)

Yes, I understand that, but it doesn't specifically say it'll use the Arab-Islamic title on a Persian, it may just use the Islamic one. Also, it says they will be used interchangeability, but it doesn't mention a confusion that we need to fix. I think we need a better source, this one is a bit vague, and I feel using it is a bit of Original Research. And I'm glad that those articles don't say they're Persian. Now, we need to fix these ones, which is our primary concern. Also, perhaps we can talk to someone more familiar with applying the MOS. For now, I am following the MOS as well as how FA biography articles are done. --Enzuru 21:37, 21 November 2008 (UTC)

One user rightfully requested we put the entire conversation on one page, so please join us on my talk page. --Enzuru 02:11, 22 November 2008 (UTC)

Al-Khwārizmī

Raayen, hi, please be aware that a consensus was reached on the talkpage of the Al-Khwārizmī‎ article that the language in the lead should be "Persian heritage", not "Persian". I see that you reverted this to a non-consensus version. Would you please consider self-reverting? If you disagree with the current consensus, you are welcome to bring it up at the talkpage and try to build a new consensus. Then once editors at the talkpage agree, the article can be changed again. In the meantime, the article should stay at the last consensus version. Thanks, --Elonka 00:41, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for understanding! It's much appreciated.  :) --Elonka 03:03, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

cats

Hi again,

I reverted some of your lang categories, since the articles were already in subcats of the categories in question. kwami (talk) 11:45, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Thank you!

Thank you for putting all those great information about Talyshi. I did most of the Zazaki article. --Daraheni (talk) 18:30, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Nowruz

"There are many regions and many Iranian languages, all of them cannot be put here"

This is an encyclopedia. All regions where the occasion is observed should be described here. 94.192.38.247 (talk) 17:12, 20 March 2009 (UTC)

I see a very coincidental convergance between yours and User:Alefbe's edit histories. I'm not accusing you of being a sockpuppet at this point, but User:Alefbe is under suspicion of using User:St. Hubert account to sock. You have both have made revisions to Nowruz in the same manner and both made revisions to the Mazandarani language page. If you are a sock and you continue persuing unencyclopedic edit revisions on Nowruz I will have to report you and I have quite a case against you at this point. Apologies if you are not. 94.192.38.247 (talk) 17:19, 20 March 2009 (UTC)

If I had wanted to have a sock puppet, I would haven't been so silly to do what you said. BTW, I think you shouldn't have removed an important part of Kurdish Nowruz history in Turkey. That is detrimental, because it tells us about thinking twice adding Turkish pronunciation of the festival on the lead.--Raayen (talk) 17:34, 20 March 2009 (UTC)