Talk:2024 Fourth of July shootings: Difference between revisions

Content deleted Content added

Inline

Revision as of 00:49, 8 July 2024

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the 2024 Fourth of July shootings article.
This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic.
New to Wikipedia? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help.

Article policies

Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL

While the biographies of living persons policy does not apply directly to the subject of this article, it may contain material that relates to living persons, such as friends and family of persons no longer living, or living persons involved in the subject matter. Unsourced or poorly sourced contentious material about living persons must be removed immediately. If such material is re-inserted repeatedly, or if there are other concerns related to this policy, please see this noticeboard.

Crime and Criminal Biography Low‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Crime and Criminal Biography, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Crime and Criminal Biography articles on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.Crime and Criminal BiographyWikipedia:WikiProject Crime and Criminal BiographyTemplate:WikiProject Crime and Criminal BiographyCrime-related articles
Niedrig	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Death Low‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Death, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Death on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.DeathWikipedia:WikiProject DeathTemplate:WikiProject DeathDeath articles
Niedrig	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Politics: American / Gun politics Low‑importance

	Politics portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Politics, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of politics on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.PoliticsWikipedia:WikiProject PoliticsTemplate:WikiProject Politicspolitics articles
Niedrig	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.
	This article is supported by American politics task force (assessed as Mid-importance).
	This article is supported by Gun politics task force (assessed as Mid-importance).

United States Low‑importance

	United States portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject United States, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of topics relating to the United States of America on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the ongoing discussions. Template Usage Articles Requested! Become a Member Project Talk Alerts United StatesWikipedia:WikiProject United StatesTemplate:WikiProject United StatesUnited States articles
Niedrig	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Daily pageviews of this article

A graph should have been displayed here but graphs are temporarily disabled. Until they are enabled again, visit the interactive graph at pageviews.wmcloud.org

Outside scope of WikiProject Firearms

I have removed the banner for WikiProject Firearms because this article appears to be outside the scope of that WikiProject. That WikiProject is about firearms and includes ... both broad concepts and specific models, ammunition, manufacturers, organizations, legislation, and historical figures such as inventors and notable gunsmiths associated with such firearms. For an article to meet the criminal use inclusion criteria, the specific type(s) firearm used needs to be notable. Articles about merely shooting a firearm does not appear to be part of the inclusion criteria for that WikiProject. Please discuss this if you think I am wrong with this judgement. Please see WP:PROJSCOPE and WP:OVERBANNER for more guidelines. - Cameron Dewe (talk) 23:57, 7 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Wikipedia is not a news website

Wikipedia is not a news website. This article appears to a collection of routine news reports about shootings across the United States without a common causal factor to tie them together, other than a particular date related to celebrating an American holiday. While the cited LA Times article is used to assert The Fourth of July is historically one of the nation's deadliest days of the year. Actually reading the source reveals that road deaths are the primary reason and that shootings aren’t necessarily part of this fatal trend. I think it is misleading to make such a bold statement in the article without explaining that the shootings do not feature in the underlying research. However, I think that without having that assertion in the article it destroys the reason for having this article in the first place, as one is left with a collection of random shootings with nothing to tie them together. I think it would be more appropriate to write an article about the United States road toll, drownings, of fireworks fatalities on the Fourth of July weekend, rather than shootings, because those causes of death appear to have a heightened risk over this holiday period. For this sort of thing to be notable, one needs sustained coverage over a longer period of time than appears in news coverage for a holiday weekend. It might be better to cover the underlying research about deaths on or about the Fourth of July, or even holidays more generally, over many years, rather than focussing on a single point in time. - Cameron Dewe (talk) 00:49, 8 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@@ Line 11: / Line 11: @@
 I have removed the banner for [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Firearms|WikiProject Firearms]] because this article appears to be outside the [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Firearms#Scope|scope]] of that WikiProject. That WikiProject is about '''firearms''' and includes ''... both broad concepts and specific models, ammunition, manufacturers, organizations, legislation, and historical figures such as inventors and notable gunsmiths associated with such firearms.'' For an article to meet the [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Firearms#Criminal use|criminal use]] inclusion criteria, the specific type(s) firearm used needs to be notable. Articles about merely shooting a firearm does not appear to be part of the inclusion criteria for that WikiProject. Please discuss this if you think I am wrong with this judgement. Please see [[WP:PROJSCOPE]] and [[WP:OVERBANNER]] for more guidelines. - [[User:Cameron Dewe|Cameron Dewe]] ([[User talk:Cameron Dewe|talk]]) 23:57, 7 July 2024 (UTC)
+== Wikipedia is not a news website ==
+Wikipedia is [[WP:NOTNEWS|not a news website]]. This article appears to a collection of [[WP:ROUTINE|routine]] news reports about shootings across the United States without a common causal factor to tie them together, other than a particular date related to celebrating an American holiday. While the cited [https://www.latimes.com/nation/nationnow/la-na-nn-fourth-of-july-deadliest-holiday-20140705-story.html LA Times article] is used to assert ''The Fourth of July is historically one of the nation's deadliest days of the year.'' Actually reading the source reveals that road deaths are the primary reason and that shootings aren’t necessarily part of this fatal trend. I think it is misleading to make such a bold statement in the article without explaining that the shootings do not feature in the underlying research. However, I think that without having that assertion in the article it destroys the reason for having this article in the first place, as one is left with a collection of random shootings with nothing to tie them together. I think it would be more appropriate to write an article about the United States road toll, drownings, of fireworks fatalities on the Fourth of July weekend, rather than shootings, because those causes of death appear to have a heightened risk over this holiday period. For this sort of thing to be notable, one needs [[WP:SUSTAINED|sustained]] coverage over a longer period of time than appears in news coverage for a holiday weekend. It might be better to cover the underlying research about deaths on or about the Fourth of July, or even holidays more generally, over many years, rather than focussing on a single point in time. - [[User:Cameron Dewe|Cameron Dewe]] ([[User talk:Cameron Dewe|talk]]) 00:49, 8 July 2024 (UTC)