Talk:Pregnancy

Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment

This article is or was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Nbetenia. Peer reviewers: Kiyannamw.

Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT (talk) 07:07, 17 January 2022 (UTC)

"Women" or "female humans"

Hi, I know the reference in the first sentance uses "woman", but isnt it more precise to say "female human", it would not only include transgender and nonbinary people, but also highlight this article is not about pregnancy of mammals in general. Nsae Comp (talk) 05:27, 27 February 2021 (UTC)

In that case, someone would just make the same objection about "female" as a gender term. Medical sources overwhelmingly say "women", so we follow WP:Due weight. Also, generally, women generally prefer to be called women, not "female human". Crossroads ^-talk- 05:47, 27 February 2021 (UTC)

Well, I at least somewhat added/raised the issue in the later part of the article since it seems to not be touched upon anywhere. Nsae Comp (talk) 05:59, 27 February 2021 (UTC)

The phrase female human would exclude intersex people.

We should follow the sources in how we talk about this subject. The sources do not emphasize people who do not have a gender identity as a woman. When that changes, the Wikipedia article will, too. WhatamIdoing (talk) 06:53, 28 February 2021 (UTC)

FUchesco, could you please join this discussion, and try to persuade people that "women" should not be mentioned at the start of an article that is not only traditionally about "women", but has also been a major excuse for discriminating against women?

Wikipedia:Edit warring will get you blocked, but people are willing to listen to you here. We all want the best article that we can have, and I am certain that is true about you, too. WhatamIdoing (talk) 18:12, 27 December 2021 (UTC)

Dates

There are three different sets of dates for when pregnancy "begins". They are:

• Last menstrual period (pregnancy begins two weeks before ovulation and fertilization)
• Conception (pregnancy begins at fertilization, which is usually ≤24 hours after ovulation)
• Implantation (pregnancy begins 5–10 days after ovulation and fertilization)

The last item is especially salient for abortion, because the pre-implantation definition means that Emergency contraception cannot be abortifacient. (There is no implanted blastocyst at that time; therefore there is no pregnancy, and you can't terminate a pregnancy that doesn't exist.) This approach is not especially common outside of abortion discussions.

I think this article would benefit from standardizing on the middle one, as it is the system most closely related to biology. What do you think? WhatamIdoing (talk) 05:07, 17 April 2022 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 23 April 2022

change woman to person and use more genderless language to be more accurate to the reality that it is not only people who identify as women who experience pregnancies (trans men, transmasculine people, intersex people with uteruses, nonbinary and genderqueer people with uteruses, ect.) Coochied (talk) 03:01, 23 April 2022 (UTC)

 Not done for now: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the {{edit semi-protected}} template. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 13:31, 23 April 2022 (UTC)

@Coochied, it sounds like you would like to have this Wikipedia article not use the word women to refer to the group of people who are physically capable of being pregnant. Keeping in mind that the "bodies with body parts" model is frequently considered an offensively reductionist approach because it reduces the whole of a human experience to something like a mindless machine made of parts,[1][2] what language would you suggest? WhatamIdoing (talk) 18:46, 5 May 2022 (UTC)

Added about Trimester origin

I saw the page didn’t mention the actual source of trimesters and I added the sentence in. It could move to Terminology. Did not put in leade as not concise. Thoughts?Manabimasu (talk) 17:57, 3 May 2022 (UTC)

@Manabimasu, here's what you wrote, which I just removed:

The origin of the trimester framework for pregnancy is in U.S. Supreme Court decision Roe v. Wade.

That court decision was in 1973. Here is a link to a 19th century obstetrics textbook. It also talks about the trimesters of pregnancy. The idea of pregnancy being divided into trimesters did not originate in a 1973 court case. It originated either in this 1888 book (an idea suggested by this book review: "The author's classification of the signs of pregnancy is especially good.  Dividing this period into trimesters...") or before it. At any rate, there is no possibility of the trimester framework having been invented by the Supreme Court some 85 years after the publication of this book. WhatamIdoing (talk) 19:00, 5 May 2022 (UTC)

To perhaps be a little clearer: The SCOTUS in 1973 took the long-existing concept of trimesters from medicine, and declare that this system should be used to determine when abortions would be legal in the US. "You can apply this long-existing medical idea to law" is not the same as "We're inventing a new idea about how to talk about the different stages of pregnancy in this court decision". WhatamIdoing (talk) 19:02, 5 May 2022 (UTC)

​Replace what I wrote with your source on the earliest mention of trimester system since origin seems to be unknown.Manabimasu (talk) 19:06, 5 May 2022 (UTC)

Does this article really need to include information about when someone decided that pregnancy could be measured in thirds instead of, say, halves or quarters? WhatamIdoing (talk) 19:42, 5 May 2022 (UTC)

Pertaining to trimester system, add as a footnote as it could take space.Manabimasu (talk) 20:00, 6 May 2022 (UTC)