Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Johnny Luk: Difference between revisions
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::::*:That is true, but we consistently interpret NPOL and the GNG in such a way that people who are only notable for being political candidates are not notable unless their candidacy was notable in some way, because all candidates generally receive at least some coverage, but tend not to have lasting notability ("you can't make yourself notable.") If our subject were notable for other reasons, there'd be no reason not to keep the article. [[User:SportingFlyer|SportingFlyer]] ''<span style="font-size:small; vertical-align:top;">[[User talk:SportingFlyer|T]]</span>''·''<span style="font-size:small; vertical-align:bottom;">[[Special:Contributions/SportingFlyer|C]]</span>'' 15:16, 11 June 2024 (UTC) |
::::*:That is true, but we consistently interpret NPOL and the GNG in such a way that people who are only notable for being political candidates are not notable unless their candidacy was notable in some way, because all candidates generally receive at least some coverage, but tend not to have lasting notability ("you can't make yourself notable.") If our subject were notable for other reasons, there'd be no reason not to keep the article. [[User:SportingFlyer|SportingFlyer]] ''<span style="font-size:small; vertical-align:top;">[[User talk:SportingFlyer|T]]</span>''·''<span style="font-size:small; vertical-align:bottom;">[[Special:Contributions/SportingFlyer|C]]</span>'' 15:16, 11 June 2024 (UTC) |
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::'''Keep''' - No evidence at all that it is a cut and paste article from press releases- indeed the examples cited are clearly interviews or written neutrally. Also note it makes no sense to delete an article just before a general election - this deletion request is clearly politically motivated. [[User:Editorman75|Editorman75]] ([[User talk:Editorman75|talk]]) 20:48, 10 June 2024 (UTC) |
::'''Keep''' - No evidence at all that it is a cut and paste article from press releases- indeed the examples cited are clearly interviews or written neutrally. Also note it makes no sense to delete an article just before a general election - this deletion request is clearly politically motivated. [[User:Editorman75|Editorman75]] ([[User talk:Editorman75|talk]]) 20:48, 10 June 2024 (UTC) |
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<small>— [[User:Editorman75|Editorman75]] ([[User talk:Editorman75|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Editorman75|contribs]]) has made [[Wikipedia:Single-purpose account|few or no other edits]] outside this topic. </small> |
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*'''Delete''' - Website already suffers with half a dozen pages for people who do not need one, and given that polling suggests that he will be [https://www.miltonkeynes.co.uk/news/politics/new-polling-suggests-change-in-milton-keynes-and-aylesbury-vale-following-2024-general-election-4654130 unlikely to win] does not really add to this article's case. Agree with everything else stated so far. [[User:Tweedle|Tweedle]] ([[User talk:Tweedle|talk]]) 16:49, 10 June 2024 (UTC) |
*'''Delete''' - Website already suffers with half a dozen pages for people who do not need one, and given that polling suggests that he will be [https://www.miltonkeynes.co.uk/news/politics/new-polling-suggests-change-in-milton-keynes-and-aylesbury-vale-following-2024-general-election-4654130 unlikely to win] does not really add to this article's case. Agree with everything else stated so far. [[User:Tweedle|Tweedle]] ([[User talk:Tweedle|talk]]) 16:49, 10 June 2024 (UTC) |
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*'''Delete''' an article on an unelected political candidate which reads like a CV and who is not otherwise notable. If he wins, we can restore the article. [[User:SportingFlyer|SportingFlyer]] ''<span style="font-size:small; vertical-align:top;">[[User talk:SportingFlyer|T]]</span>''·''<span style="font-size:small; vertical-align:bottom;">[[Special:Contributions/SportingFlyer|C]]</span>'' 19:28, 10 June 2024 (UTC) |
*'''Delete''' an article on an unelected political candidate which reads like a CV and who is not otherwise notable. If he wins, we can restore the article. [[User:SportingFlyer|SportingFlyer]] ''<span style="font-size:small; vertical-align:top;">[[User talk:SportingFlyer|T]]</span>''·''<span style="font-size:small; vertical-align:bottom;">[[Special:Contributions/SportingFlyer|C]]</span>'' 19:28, 10 June 2024 (UTC) |
Revision as of 17:08, 11 June 2024
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- Johnny Luk (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log | edits since nomination)
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The subject does not meet general notability requirements or the notability requirements for a politician. The only coverage of the subject is by local and obscure outlets who provide run-of-the-mill coverage of him as a candidate in local elections. thena (talk) 19:01, 9 June 2024 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Politicians, Conservatism, Hong Kong, and United Kingdom. Spiderone(Talk to Spider) 20:05, 9 June 2024 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of England-related deletion discussions. WCQuidditch ☎ ✎ 22:39, 9 June 2024 (UTC)
- Delete Agree that subject lacks required notability for an article. Williehuggies (talk)
- Williehuggies (talk) 10:05, 10 June 2024 (UTC)
- Delete I also agree that the subject lacks required notability. A bright cold day in april (talk)
- A bright cold day in april (talk) 12:10, 10 June 2024 (UTC)
Keep: By searching with the subject person's Chinese name 陸勤業, I found numerous sources which documented his biography outside of his political career in detail, including Wen Wei Po[1], The News Lens[2], Phoenix Television[3], BBC[4], as well as a Wen Wei Po interview about Hong Kong immigrants' endeavors in the UK[5]. The article has also presented several sources that documented his political career, such as Camden New Journal[6] and Islington Tribune[7]. Adding up both the Chinese and English sources, I think the subject person has obviously met GNG. @Williehuggies and A bright cold day in april: Please take a look at the sources and rationales I presented. —Prince of Erebor(The Book of Mazarbul) 13:29, 10 June 2024 (UTC)
- Comment: My bad for not providing Chinese translation in my first comment, I have placed the translated versions of the five Chinese sources below:
Translations
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1.Wen Wei Po: In this UK general election, there are 9 British Chinese candidates running, including 29-year-old Conservative Party candidate Johnny Luk, who was born in Hong Kong. Luk, who is running for Parliament for the first time, recounts his experience of racial discrimination during his studies, revealing that he was once told to "go back to China." He calls on the Chinese community to speak up more, to drive improvements in the government's policies and funding for the Chinese community, and even to influence the UK's foreign relations with East Asia.
2.The News Lens: This includes 32-year-old Johnny Luk, who contested the Hampstead and Kilburn constituency in the 2019 general election.
3.Phoenix Television: Johnny Luk, 25 years old, followed his parents to immigrate to the UK when he was 10 years old. After graduating from a university in the UK, he now works at a non-profit organization, helping university graduates in the UK realize their entrepreneurial dreams.
4.BBC: "Seeing what is happening (in Hong Kong), I feel very sad," said 29-year-old Conservative Party candidate Johnny Luk. Although China is sometimes controversial, the China-UK relationship is still much better than the relationship between Russia and the UK. "I hope I can build a bridge between China and the UK, and enhance mutual understanding," said the 29-year-old Conservative Party candidate Johnny Luk.
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- In my opinion, even if the two English sources discussed below are excluded, these five sources already provided enough SIGCOV to pass WP:GNG and should be kept. —Prince of Erebor(The Book of Mazarbul) 14:45, 10 June 2024 (UTC)
- Delete. If he's elected in the general election next month, the article can be recreated but for the time being he doesn't meet WP:POLITICIAN or WP:GNG. As to the Camden New Journal and Islington Tribune articles mentioned by others, these seem to be cut-and-paste jobs from press releases put out by his campaign, which is sadly the norm in British local newspapers. I would argue that they do not constitute significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject. Lincolnite (talk) 13:52, 10 June 2024 (UTC)
- @Lincolnite: Hi Lincolnite. I have also presented five Chinese sources which documented his life not related to the elections in SIGCOV. Please review the sources I have provided, and enlighten me why you find the notability is still not demonstrated from them.
If you need help with the translations, please let me know as well.(Edit:I have provided translations above.) —Prince of Erebor(The Book of Mazarbul) 14:12, 10 June 2024 (UTC)- Delete - nothing he has done prior to or including his candidacy are notable enough to warrant an article. Half a dozen puff pieces on the same subject is not significant enough to meet the GNG significant coverage requirement. Saltywalrusprkl (talk) 15:34, 10 June 2024 (UTC)
- He is barely mentioned in the Chinese language articles, which are all about people running for office, and aren't even specifically on him. SportingFlyer T·C 01:39, 11 June 2024 (UTC)
- @SportingFlyer: Hmm... Mind reading the two Wen Wei Po and the Phoenix Television articles again? Not sure how you came up with the conclusion that he was "barely mentioned" and was mentioned along with other candidates. Two of them aren't even related to elections at all (which were published in 2015). —Prince of Erebor(The Book of Mazarbul) 04:18, 11 June 2024 (UTC)
- One Wen Wei Po article is about Xi Jinping visiting England, as is the Phoenix Television article. He's mentioned, but that's clearly not significant coverage of him - it looks like he was just interviewed for an article. The other Wen Wei Po article is simply about how he's running as a candidate, which falls afoul of our policies on political candidates (just passing GNG doesn't count since almost all candidates receive some coverage.) SportingFlyer T·C 05:58, 11 June 2024 (UTC)
- @SportingFlyer: Thanks for reviewing the sources again. I respectfully beg to differ with the last part of your statement. NPOL (along with all NBLP) can be mutually exclusive from GNG. An article can pass GNG and be kept even if there are concerns about NPOL. I also want to note that I disagree with some of the delete !votes in this discussion that brought up stuffs like poll results, which have no bearing on notability. However, since multiple editors have found the Chinese sources to be run-of-the-mill, the consensus seems clear and I no longer have a strong rationale to argue that the subject person meets GNG. Therefore, I will retract my keep !vote and instead go for a Weak delete. —Prince of Erebor(The Book of Mazarbul) 06:54, 11 June 2024 (UTC)
- That is true, but we consistently interpret NPOL and the GNG in such a way that people who are only notable for being political candidates are not notable unless their candidacy was notable in some way, because all candidates generally receive at least some coverage, but tend not to have lasting notability ("you can't make yourself notable.") If our subject were notable for other reasons, there'd be no reason not to keep the article. SportingFlyer T·C 15:16, 11 June 2024 (UTC)
- @SportingFlyer: Thanks for reviewing the sources again. I respectfully beg to differ with the last part of your statement. NPOL (along with all NBLP) can be mutually exclusive from GNG. An article can pass GNG and be kept even if there are concerns about NPOL. I also want to note that I disagree with some of the delete !votes in this discussion that brought up stuffs like poll results, which have no bearing on notability. However, since multiple editors have found the Chinese sources to be run-of-the-mill, the consensus seems clear and I no longer have a strong rationale to argue that the subject person meets GNG. Therefore, I will retract my keep !vote and instead go for a Weak delete. —Prince of Erebor(The Book of Mazarbul) 06:54, 11 June 2024 (UTC)
- @SportingFlyer: Hmm... Mind reading the two Wen Wei Po and the Phoenix Television articles again? Not sure how you came up with the conclusion that he was "barely mentioned" and was mentioned along with other candidates. Two of them aren't even related to elections at all (which were published in 2015). —Prince of Erebor(The Book of Mazarbul) 04:18, 11 June 2024 (UTC)
- Keep - No evidence at all that it is a cut and paste article from press releases- indeed the examples cited are clearly interviews or written neutrally. Also note it makes no sense to delete an article just before a general election - this deletion request is clearly politically motivated. Editorman75 (talk) 20:48, 10 June 2024 (UTC)
- @Lincolnite: Hi Lincolnite. I have also presented five Chinese sources which documented his life not related to the elections in SIGCOV. Please review the sources I have provided, and enlighten me why you find the notability is still not demonstrated from them.
— Editorman75 (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
- Delete - Website already suffers with half a dozen pages for people who do not need one, and given that polling suggests that he will be unlikely to win does not really add to this article's case. Agree with everything else stated so far. Tweedle (talk) 16:49, 10 June 2024 (UTC)
- Löschen an article on an unelected political candidate which reads like a CV and who is not otherwise notable. If he wins, we can restore the article. SportingFlyer T·C 19:28, 10 June 2024 (UTC)
- Keep: The timing of this deletion request seems strange, just weeks before a General Election. His page was up all the way till now, when arguably he is more significant now than before. The only poll that matters is the actual election result, so this comment also does not add to the debate. Editorman75 (talk) 20:45, 10 June 2024 (UTC)
- Keep : He has been mentioned in multiple publications, such as this from the BBC: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-67370571
- He’s also a regular writer for world federation rowing, an Olympic sport: https://worldrowing.com/2023/05/10/the-irish-powerhouse-that-is-skibbereen-rowing-club/
- I see absolutely no reason to move to delete this article, other than political motivation from rival candidates. This should be a factual and unbiased repository, regardless of potential election outcomes this is a person of note to be recorded. Editorman75 (talk) 20:59, 10 June 2024 (UTC)
- There are several people advocating to keep this article, so I should probably expand my comment - every single source in the article is about him being a candidate, which we do not consider notable under the GNG and NPOL - local or general does not matter. The sources presented here are either election related or written by him, or he's been interviewed, including the non-English sources, which I translated. If he gets elected, he'll be eligible for an article, and I don't know why this is up for deletion now, but it's probably just because someone noticed. But this is a classic "only a candidate" article. SportingFlyer T·C 01:38, 11 June 2024 (UTC)
- Keep: The first editor suggested he was a local candidate. This is not true, he is not a candidate for the local elections - but for the General Election in 2019 and 2024[1][2]. That should heighten his notability. This was also highlighted by PR Week[3], a major publication. He was also mentioned by a range of major papers introducing the UK Prime Minister Rishi Sunak, including the Evening Standard[4]. In terms of other notability, he is clearly been a writer[5] for Al Jazeera, a major publication and the HuffPost[6]. RogueWanderer29 (talk) 21:28, 10 June 2024 (UTC)
- Please see WP:NPOL. Simply being a candidate for office does not confer notability. The Evening Standard is routine campaign coverage, primarily about Rishi Sunak campaigning in Buckinghamshire, and only name-checks Luk right at the end: "He was introduced at the Q&A session by Johnny Luk, the Conservative candidate for Milton Keynes Central" - that is a long way from demonstrating notability. AusLondonder (talk) 17:00, 11 June 2024 (UTC)
- Keep WP:SIGCOV in both UK and Chinese language sources. AlessandroTiandelli333 (talk) 23:40, 10 June 2024 (UTC)
- ^ "Milton Keynes Central". BBC.
- ^ Whocanivotefor UK General Election https://whocanivotefor.co.uk/person/71469/ UK General Election.
{{cite web}}
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(help) - ^ Owen, Jonathan. "Conservative general election comms revealed". PR Weekly.
- ^ Cecil, Nicholas. "RIshi Sunak challenged over partygate scandal fine by man whose mum died in Covid pandemic".
- ^ Luk, Johnny. https://www.aljazeera.com/author/johnny-luk.
{{cite web}}
: Missing or empty|title=
(help) - ^ Luk, Johnny. https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/author/johnny-luk.
{{cite web}}
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(help)