Talk:Linkin Park

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Alternative Metal

I think Alternative Metal would also be needed in the Bands genres. Alternative Rock only can refer to Minutes to Midnight. But some of the bands Songs (From the inside,Easier to run,Pushing me away and even Numb) are exactly Alternative metal or a Mixture of Alternative Metal And Nu Metal.

Well, "alternative rock" can also refer to most of the songs on Meteora, and a few on Hybrid Theory, so I think it should stay. Alternative metal, I am fairly neutral on. ^Tezkag₇₂ 14:05, 2 December 2008 (UTC)

umm...I don't know..You're right.I didn't say "I think Alternative Rock is not correct".I meant Alternative Rock wasn't enough and it didn't describe the band's sound completely. As I said before, "Easier to Run" , "Pushing me away" ,"from the Inside" , "Numb" , "in the End", "Forgotten" and many other songs are a mixture of Nu Metal and Alternative Metal. I agree many others are Alternative Rock.I don't know,I think if you add Alternative Metal,It will describe their sound better.(Solino the Wolf (talk) 19:55, 2 December 2008 (UTC))

Well, tell whoever reverted it. The genre field is always controversial. And yes, I would agree that a number of their songs are very "alternative metal". Namely, Pushing Me Away (and P5hng Me A*wy), Hit the Floor, No More Sorrow (although that's more "industrial rock"), and 1stp Klosr. To name a few. ^Tezkag₇₂ 22:10, 2 December 2008 (UTC)

Why not both alt. metal and rock, since metal is a sub-genre of rock? Petero9 (talk) 22:24, 3 December 2008 (UTC)

Well, I think alternative rock should definitely stay, and to a lesser extent, alternative metal. ^Tezkag₇₂ 22:37, 3 December 2008 (UTC)

I think it's better to write both.Solino the Wolf (talk) 20:13, 6 December 2008 (UTC)

Well, let's have both, then. ^Tezkag₇₂ 20:28, 6 December 2008 (UTC)

Some people really should learn what alternative metal means before discussing it.

Alternative metal means, at the core, heavy metal, but played in an unusual or alternative style. LP don't fit that in the slightest. Their early work is nu metal/rapcore, their latest is alternative rock, without the barest hint of metal.

Alternative metal does not mean, as so many seem to think, a band that plays with distorted guitars, yet doesn't sound like metal in any other way. Prophaniti (talk) 08:39, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Prophaniti's right!Alternative metal doesn't mean that.It means that the music has alternating verses and choruses.Like SOAD.(and LP :-P)Solino the Wolf (talk) 22:33, 27 December 2008 (UTC)

But nu metal is a sub genre of alternative metal. And when you tell people they need to learn what something means you always look like a dick, so for your sake I'll tell you it's not a good idea. That's my two scents 01:52, 17 December 2008 (UTC)

Here's a simple solution to the alt metal problem: Find a reliable source and it stays. If not, it has got to go. Timmeh! 03:14, 17 December 2008 (UTC)

Exactly part of my reasoning for removal. Prophaniti (talk) 08:45, 17 December 2008 (UTC)

And now I've gone through and added many such sources. If they should be moved, do feel free to do so, but they illustrate a point: of all the sources available, only one (allmusic) terms them "alt. metal". None of the others do, they're all firmly united on nu metal and rap-rock as the band's genres (and alt. rock for their latest). As such, to include alt. metal in the genre field itself would be to give it undue weight as a minority view. Prophaniti (talk) 00:08, 18 December 2008 (UTC)

I'll find a source for it.Caus it's FUNNY!The most thing heard in their music is Alt.Metal.It's so obvious that I'm sure I'll find sources for that+ who did say all music is not a reliable source?I myself dont count them a good source but as in MANY articles in Wikipedia,Allmusic is used as a source,you can't say it's not reliable,or you'll have to re write Many articles in wikipedia.(Come on!How can someone think "Pushing me away" and "From the inside" are not alt.Metal???)Solino the Wolf (talk) 21:57, 26 December 2008 (UTC)

ok I found a reliable source for it and I added it.Solino the Wolf (talk) 22:00, 26 December 2008 (UTC)

How can I think such songs aren’t alt. metal? Because they’re not even close. I won’t go into the big details that could be outlined, but suffice to say, there’s pretty much zero metal content in Linkin Park’s songs (and no, that isn't a criticism of a metal elitist, it's just an impartial, informed analysis).

But anyway, it doesn’t matter: the source you’ve provided (Pandora) isn’t a reliable one.

ok I dont wanna talk about what alt metal is here.Everybody knowing a little bit of music knows what it is and can say LP is alt metal.(Actually my job is about the history of modern music and I've been reading about genres for 20 years and that's why I'm sure about what I say)I have a source.Don't say allmusic is not reliable.In many articles it has been used as reliable.So if you think it's not reliable first edit those article(for example almost the only source for alternative metal's article is allmusic)Solino the Wolf (talk) 22:14, 30 December 2008 (UTC)

Allmusic certainly is considered a reliable source. So really it just depends on whether one source among all those we have should be taken as a minority view and not included. Right now, I'm not really awake enough to ponder it. In some articles one genre allmusic gives isn't used because it's clearly a minority view not worth giving undue weight. In this case it's less clear cut. Prophaniti (talk) 22:33, 30 December 2008 (UTC)

Alternative Metal refers to bands such as System of a Down and Tool (band)RiseAgainst01 (talk) 21:06, 1 January 2009 (UTC)

Yes, bands that actually have some heavy metal influence in their music. Prophaniti (talk) 09:41, 5 January 2009 (UTC)

No, Linkin Park has metal influence too, just not as prominent. ^Tezkag₇₂ 22:07, 5 January 2009 (UTC)

I'm afraid they don't. Note that this isn't a criticism. I love the band. There just really isn't any metal influence in them. Disturbed, System of a Down, Soundgarden, Faith No More, those are bands that have metal influence even if they're arguably not strictly "metal bands". Linkin Park's sound is a mix of hip hop, hardcore and post-grunge, no metal in there. Prophaniti (talk) 22:12, 5 January 2009 (UTC)

Actually, several sources describe Linkin Park as a metal band. This includes allmusic and Rolling Stone. Also, nu metal fuses influences from alt metal with other genres. Linkin Park is arguably an alt metal band, and this probably should be mentioned in the style section. However, for the infobox, alt metal should not be listed because nu metal covers it. Timmeh! 23:10, 5 January 2009 (UTC)

Oh, certainly sources term them it, and I'm not disputing that point. I'm simply making my point (and that's all it is) that Linkin Park really don't have any heavy metal elements to their music. However, as you say, it's not really worth including beyond the styles section, because nu metal covers it and is much more heavily sourced. Prophaniti (talk) 12:46, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

Ok.many articles in wikipedia just have one source.You can look at Slipknot's article which has claimed them to be heavy metal just whith one source.So if you think it's a minority view you should go for those articles as well.Solino the Wolf (talk) 09:36, 5 January 2009 (UTC)

If you want to contest that, then go right ahead. Take a look at WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS; it's not good enough to simply say something exists elsewhere. If there's only a single source on Slipknot's page referring to them as heavy metal and there are many others that don't, then you'd have a case, as it is here. It's a minority view: the source consensus is nu metal, rap rock and (more recently) alt. rock. Prophaniti (talk) 09:41, 5 January 2009 (UTC)

It exactly is the same in slipknot's article and many other articles.Plus I dont wanna fight anymore about this.As I said,Anyone listening to from the inside can say it's alt metal. Solino the Wolf (talk) 13:13, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

Seeing as how their last "nu metal" album was Hybrid Theory, and arguably parts of Meteora, I don't feel it should be listed first in the genre section. Lnkinprk777 (talk) 03:37, 6 May 2009 (UTC)

Recent?

I propose remove the "(recent)" part after "alternative rock" in the genre field. This is ignoring some of Linkin Park's earlier songs that are alternative rock like Numb, In the End, Runaway, Breaking the Habit, well I could go on a bit more but those are the songs that have "alternative rock" listed on their articles. Anyone agree? ^Tezkag₇₂ 20:38, 3 January 2009 (UTC)

I think the best thing (as it usually is) is to simply go with the sources. In this case, we have two sources terming their work "alternative rock", and both of those are reviews of Minutes to Midnight. So as things stand, the "recent" tag does fit. But if other sources could be found terming their older work alternative rock, then it could be removed without problem, I'd say. Prophaniti (talk) 14:35, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

Screamo

Um, Should we list them as Screamo too? I mean if you listen to screamo, a couple of songs, like Given Up, Sound like Screamo, Just a thought.I mean Everyone I talk to considers them part screamo.Thanks and Peace Out—Permethius (talk) 13:09, 17 March 2009 (UTC)

No, just one song and sections of a few others aren't enough to list it as a genre. And besides, there are plenty of other genres they use more than screamo that aren't listed. There's only two to preempt any edit wars over their genre. That's my two scents 15:03, 17 March 2009 (UTC)

Rap Rock & Rapcore

hey guys i'm a big fan of linkin park and i'm very interested in music genres! i don't think that rap rock hits the point very good, because it doesn't cover the hardcore influences in the music of the band! you can't deny that there is much hardcore influence in ht and meteora, so i think that there should be a mentioning of rapCORE in the styles or in the genres section! or you can let rap rock there and add hardcore, or hardcore influences into the styles! i even think that the metal influences from nu metal and the harcore influences could possibly be described as metalcore, so i would even find it possible to mention metalcore as influence or even as genre behing alternativ rock. so what do you think? —Preceding unsigned comment added by LuffyGear2 (talk • contribs) 15:50, 20 March 2009 (UTC)

Rapcore is a style within hardcore punk which uses rap instead of the classic vocals and it dates back into the eighties & nineties with groups like Suicidal Tendencies (i.e. the song "Join the Army" in 1987), Sick of it all & Agnostic Front . Linkin Park are not Rapcore as they are not even a group that plays any form of Hardcore Punk other that the use of metalcore / screamo style vocals. Infact even Metalcore is supposed to be a sub-genre of Hardcore Punk and is short for "Metallic hardcore" the same way Emocore is short for "Emotional hardcore", but that another story and I don't want to upset the shallow naive metal fans who think anything noisy with agressive guitaring is a sub-genre of heavy metal music as they know nothing of the equally growing punk scene. They are naive to the fact that punk (hardcore especially) grew noisier, more energetic and more aggressive before metal did and actually influenced the evolved NWOBHM, Thrash Metal & Death Metal which were all groups taking the older traditional slower bluesier Heavy Metal and mixing it with the faster energetic guitar blasting punk. Punks were shouting, screaming and grunting vocals long before metal ever caught onto it.

Remember to sign your posts please. But you are part right, Punk did thrash and grunt long before metal. Look at the metal founding fathers, led zeppelin. But you are also wrong. Rapcore evolved from rapmetal, which evolved from metal. Metal bands took on a more rthm based lyrical form, and eventually turned much of the verses into a rap. Eventually people caught on and infused rap with other rock genre's, namely the beasty boys and limp bizkit thus creating rapcore.Drew Smith What I've done 14:04, 11 May 2009 (UTC)

Genre

Damn, THEY ARE NOT NU METAL!!! I'm talking about the first sentence of the article - "Linkin Park are an American nu metal band..." Nu metal was only Hybrid Theory. Then, Meteora was 100% different from HT - it was something like alternative rock/alternative metal. And their last album - Minutes To Midnight - is... just rock. Or alternative rock, if you wish. So, they have only one nu metal album and it's their oldest album :) I'll change it into "Linkin Park are an American rock band" :) PS: Linkin Park 4ever :) Darkmastertr (talk) 16:49, 12 April 2009 (UTC)

Oops, now I saw that I shouldn't change it without consulting here. OK, what's your opinion? You can't tell them "nu metal band" when their last (and first) nu metal album is from 2000... :) Darkmastertr (talk) 16:53, 12 April 2009 (UTC)

Rock is fine, it includes all of their subgenres. That's my two scents 15:20, 14 April 2009 (UTC)

Emo

Is LP also an EMO band?I asked it because it has made many sad songs,especially in METEORA which are very expressive. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Bellerophon 691 (talk • contribs) 17:09, 26 April 2009 (UTC)

Is Linkin Park being classified as emo in several reliable sources? If not, they're not emo as far as Wikipedia is concerned. Timmeh! 17:16, 26 April 2009 (UTC)

Just because they have lyrics that are stereotypically considered "emo", doesn't mean they are of the emo genre. Shan (talk) 01:34, 2 May 2009 (UTC)

there genre

yeah they are nu metal and alternative rock but i think more should be added to their genre. i think rapcore should be added as well as alternative metal and change rock ot nu metal because it wasnt just hybrid theory, meteora still had a nu metal sound as well as alternative metal. u should also add rap/rock. the best example of their rap/rock songs are In The End. i think that really works. Numb seems like alternative rock. Hit the floor seems rapcore. You should also add rap. Like hands held high. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mixernack (talk • contribs) 04:17, 9 May 2009 (UTC)

I think the genres in the infobox are fine as they are now, they don't need to be changed any further. Nu metal/rapcore because that was their primary style in their first few albums, alt rock because it's the predominant genre in MtM as well as a major subgenre in their earlier albums. They don't have enough alt metal songs to warrant the inclusion of this genre in the infobox. Jerkov (talk) 13:13, 9 May 2009 (UTC)

Dare I say...industrial rock? Tezkag72 (talk) 02:21, 22 May 2009 (UTC).

Just a Suggestion

I think there should be a full bio of all the members since i love the band and i feel stupid when my friends are talking about the band and i know noting about it. *Marie* (talk) 06:40, 21 May 2009 (UTC)

Band Members

I think that Rob Bourdon and Dave Farrell's pages should be re-created. I don't know why they've been removed in the first place!! Ahmad halawani (talk) 18:45, 23 May 2009 (UTC)

The Phoenix and Rob articles were redirected here because they did not meet Wikipedia's Notability standards for musicians. While the two are very popular figures, Wikipedia's policies will only allow a subject to maintain its own article if it possess enough substantial information, that can be verified by respected and reliable third-party sources (WP:N). The Shinoda and Bennington articles were different, since there were many sources that specially covered their early life, musical career, and personal information. For future reference to other editors, here are the AFDS:

• Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Rob Bourdon
• Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Dave Farrell

Brad Delson and Mr. Hahn have been tagged for notability in the past, and can potentially lose thier articles in the future as well. :-\ --  StarScream1007  ►Talk  20:01, 23 May 2009 (UTC)

Why don't we integrate the info from those articles into this article as subsections? Bennington and Shinoda definitely should remain seperate though. Jerkov (talk) 22:27, 30 May 2009 (UTC)

not nu metal

i remember a looooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooong time ago i came across this page and there was a page describeing their sound i hadnt really read it but at the bottom it said that they said their not nu metal and had gave a reason. i belive there are but im just wondering where it went and why its gone? it was right next to the pictue of mike speaking into a mic —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.79.237.121 (talk) 02:28, 4 June 2009 (UTC)

new genre's in genre field

i added more genre's . and i have a source WHO KEEPS DELETING MY GENRE'S I HAD A SOURCE —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mixernack (talk • contribs) 22:39, 5 June 2009 (UTC)

Dave Farrell

Dave Farrell should be changed to Phoenix, or at the least Dave "Phoneix" Farrell. He is addressed as such not only by fans, but the BAND MEMBERS, is addressed that way in interviews, and is very rarely addressed as Dave Farrell. It doesn't really make much sense to refuse to call someone by their stage name simply because it's not their given name, even more so as he is known that way personally as well as professionally. The Edit Corrector (talk) 22:01, 6 June 2009 (UTC)

Linkin Park; changed to a more moral route with their last album?

it seems that Linkin Park has change from their original "rap/rock about previous problems (hence "in the end it doesn't even matter" in their debut album smash hit "In the End") to a more morally influenced band (Hands Held High's "miss something, take back what's yours, say something that you know they might attack you for" which seems to be promoting opposition to oppression by the government). i think that this notable change in style must be added to the article under the "style" section or add an "evolution" section on how the band has changed both themselves and their fans over the years. GregCrudo (talk) 17:31, 14 June 2009 (UTC)

Dead by Sunrise

Linkin park's front man Is currently working on another band called Dead by sunrise. He says it is a full band and not a side project. Coincidently they are working onn a new CD to be called Dead by Sunrise. Weather or not Linkin park will remain is to be seen. The CD is expected to be done by The end of 2009. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Adultlink210 (talk • contribs) 21:41, 15 June 2009 (UTC)

years active

someone needs to edit their years active, almost like someone wanted to puposefully skewer their years. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Dimuro (talk • contribs) 17:16, 18 June 2009 (UTC)

The field is correct. The band was formed in 1996 and has been active ever since. Timmeh!_{(review me)} 17:48, 18 June 2009 (UTC)

Session musicians

Kyle Christener and Scott Koziol are listed as session musicians in the Band Members section,while listed as former members in the infobox.I tried to modify appropriately,but the table markup has me lost.Please fix either one of the two.EaswarH (talk) 07:32, 22 June 2009 (UTC)

changed the first line

the first line of this page says there a rock band which doesn't quite make it i think. i changed it to something that makes more sense and plz dotn change it without giveing a reason not to