Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/J9A10

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. Only reference is to a commercial site that proclaims "J9A10.com brings to you for the first time in the world an online version of the Card Game 56", which supports the delete opinions that this is an advertisement for an online game site. —Doug Bell ^talk 04:55, 24 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

J9A10

Same mega-spam, blatant advertising as Fifty-six (card game) also afd'ed 2005 11:27, 12 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Delete, blatant self-promotion of a minor gambling site. --McGeddon 11:28, 12 February 2007 (UTC) Delete after merging any original content with Twenty-eight (card game) - "J9A10" seems to be a promotional term for the exact same group of games, used only by J9A10.com. --McGeddon 16:59, 16 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Update - There's a verbatim copy of the article at J9A10 (card game), which should be deleted as well. --McGeddon 12:17, 12 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

whoa, DELETE!. Super long long article that I'll bet (no pun intended..) is a mere copy from their site. This search does nothing at all to help give me even a hint that they could perhaps just maybe be notable. Thus delete. Mathmo ^Talk 11:37, 12 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Please take a closer look Let us not make the mistake of judging a book by its cover. This is not a gambling site It is surprising that we are talking about deleting the reference to the only available online version of the most popular card game in Kerala, India. There are a few million Keralaties in the world and they will not be too happy with this attitude of Wikipedia Editorial Staff, Is there no single person who edits Wikipedia from Kerala India to bring reason to the table! --Kerala Online 11:45, 12 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

The card game itself is an appropriate subject for a Wikipedia article; an advert for a site that runs an online version of it isn't. (Even less so when it currently only seems to be "available to a select set of Beta Testers" - from the pages that weren't broken or locked, I was unable to determine whether the site was gambling-orientated or not; the poker chips in the logo suggested it was.) At most this should just be a link at the end of a neutral article about the history and rules of Fifty-Six. --McGeddon 10:59, 13 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]
The current version of the article is an improvement, but I don't see any information here that wouldn't be better placed in the existing article for the Twenty-eight card game and its variants. Am I correct in assuming from Google results that when you say "J9A10 is a group of a trick-taking games" you mean "a number of games that J9A10.com has chosen to host" rather than anything of wider significance? The term "J9A10" does not appear to be used outside of your site. --McGeddon 19:25, 13 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

J9A10 is not just a game it is also the name for the class of games defined by the unique hierarchy J,9,A,10. All games including 28, 29, 56 and others which use the J9A10 hierarchy have multiple references on the internet and Pagat. Ironically enough this class of games(J9A10) is neither discussed not referenced anywhere on the internet. The site is devoted to the class and is not on just a particular game. Should there not be a page for the Class of games J9A10 on Wikipedia? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 71.250.232.151 (talk • contribs) 22:50, 13 February 2007 (UTC).[reply]

Also you mentioned that the game is not open to public. Though the site says at this time it is open to Beta Testers only. But it is in fact open to the public, if you try registering it will let you open a new beta testing account and play the game. The game is free like Wikipedia and has no levels or usage restriction. Guess the reason there is a beta testing restriction is just to ensure there is no flood of user traffic. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 71.250.232.151 (talk • contribs) 23:10, 13 February 2007 (UTC).[reply]

Delete as spam. Wikipedia is not a game guide. Also, if a "few million" Keralaties in the world cared about this game enough, there would have been an article on it already. Hopefully one of them will rewrite a new article that does not violate Wikipedia policy - assuming the game really is notable. Resolute 23:45, 12 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Delete, this article is clearly spam. Even if the subject had some merit, the content is too clearly infused with spammy references to the site the article's author is clearly promoting. --Muldrake 02:14, 13 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Looks like the author is listening The page has been changed and the spammy references have been removed. --Kerala Online 02:15, 13 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

DELETE!!! Now the page contains nothing but links to the author's site. This is nothing but a vanity page. Additionally, the author has posted links to this page to off-topic usenet groups. This behavior must not be rewarded. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by KevinCline (talk • contribs) 09:13, 13 February 2007 (UTC).[reply]

Keep. I have removed the copyrighted material. I think we should give the author a chance to make a real article here. - grubber 17:30, 13 February 2007 (UTC) Speedy delete. This is copied verbatim from [1]. Although the topic is notable, this content must be removed immediately. - grubber 17:28, 13 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks Grubber really appreciate your giving the chance to keep the page. The author is new to Wikipedia and it would really help if you or someone from Wikipedia could guide the author to make this article appropriate as per Wikipedia's policies. --Kerala Online 18:45, 13 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]
- I will do my best :) - grubber 19:51, 13 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]
- Just because you open a website doesn't mean you can have a wikipedia article about it, especially since no other site on the Internet even mentions it. 2005 22:49, 13 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]
- The page has been revised to represent the generic game class and no longer has any properitary content from the site nor does it promote the site in any way. J9A10 22:49, 13 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

J9A10 is not just a game it is also the name for the class of games defined by the unique hierarchy J,9,A,10. All games including 28, 29, 56 and others which use the J9A10 hierarchy have multiple references on the internet and Pagat. Ironically enough this class of games is neither discussed not referenced anywhere on the internet. Should there not be a page for the Class of games J9A10? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 71.250.232.151 (talk • contribs) 22:50, 13 February 2007 (UTC).[reply]

Perhaps you're just forgetting to log in, but please don't use more than one identity in discussion on an AfD, User:J9A10, and try to sign your posts properly.

If a subject "is neither discussed nor referenced anywhere", then no, it should not have a page - every Wikipedia article requires a reliable source, so that other editors can verify that it's not being made up or misrepresented. There is already a page for the Twenty-eight class of card games, which seems to be what you're describing here - if "J9A10" is a verifiably common synonym for that class in Kerala, then it should be mentioned on the Twenty-eight page, and J9A10 can redirect to it. --McGeddon 10:55, 14 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Delete, promotion of one site, no non-trivial sources are given to verify the article. feydey 16:10, 14 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Keep. Please check the revisions to the page! tp 23:32, 14 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Comment - I'm not aware of a card game called J 9 A 10, which you claim is popular in Kerala. Could you please provide the name of the game in Malayalam, if possible?--thunderboltz ^(Deepu) 06:54, 16 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Please refer to the latest version of J9A10 it should clarify J9A10 23:51, 16 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Comment I am from Kerala and quite familiar with 28 & 56 (used to a decent player too) but I have never heard of it being called 'J9A10'. I am for keeping the current version of 56 which is on AfD but for this one I plead ignorance. Tintin 07:15, 16 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Great to know that you are a Fifty Six player. Please refer J9A10 for the explanation on the origins and evolution of this class of games and how 56 and 28 came about. J9A10 23:51, 16 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so that consensus may be reached
Please add new discussions below this notice. Thanks, Quarl ^(talk) 21:49, 17 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Redirect to Twenty-eight (card game) if and only if references can be given showing notability. Otherwise, Delete. --Sneftel 03:38, 21 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Comment. Hard time finding online references i can do some OR and quote references if that will help? tp 20:42, 21 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.