Wikipedia:WikiProject Deletion sorting/Bangladesh
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Bangladesh
- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was keep. Doczilla Ohhhhhh, no! 04:02, 6 June 2024 (UTC)
- Abubakar Muhammad Zakaria (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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No significant coverage in independent, reliable secondary sources. Fails WP:GNG. - AlbeitPK (talk) 06:43, 23 May 2024 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: People, Islam, and Bangladesh. AlbeitPK (talk) 06:43, 23 May 2024 (UTC)
- Keep. The article clearly meets the WP:ACADEMIC policy 4 no criteria. Because, some books written by him are taught in the university of Bangladesh, See here. ~ Deloar Akram (Talk • Contribute) 09:53, 25 May 2024 (UTC)
- Keep Independent and reliable sources are available. Also, several academic books are taught in university.Md Joni Hossain (talk) 14:08, 29 May 2024 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Policy-based arguments would be appreciated. The fact that books written by the article subject are used in university courses is not a valid argument to Keep. We delete plenty of articles on academics who have written books used in coursework somewhere.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz Read! Talk! 05:51, 30 May 2024 (UTC)
- Comment - I'm not able to find reliable sources in English that show his academic profile, I assume they must exist in non-English languages so would appreciate it if someone could offer them for consideration. Currently there are claims on the page but, as far as I see, not much which can be verified per WP:V. JMWt (talk) 06:48, 30 May 2024 (UTC)
- @JMWt: "Dr Abu Bakar Muhammad Zakaria - Curriculum Vitae" see here. 202.134.9.128 (talk) 03:42, 1 June 2024 (UTC)
- Friend, a self-published CV is not suitable for WP:V JMWt (talk) 05:10, 1 June 2024 (UTC)
- Keep His tafsir is the only bengali tafsir, published and approved by Saudi government printed by King Fahd Complex for the Printing of the Holy Quran https://quranenc.com/en/browse/bengali_zakaria and his book "Shirk fil Qadim wal Hadis is a famous book, many scholars quoted from it including Ali al-Sallabi, his Book Hindusiat wa tasur is the most famous Islamic academic book on Hinduism in Arab world after the book "Fusulun fi Adianil Hind" written by Ziaur Rahman Azmi, and he wrote the book as his thesis in Madinah University under the supervision of Ziaur Rahman Azmi and followed him, he is an official bengali representative of Saudi religious propagation ministry who supervise the bengali section of www.islamhouse.com/bn and he has also entry in shamila library https://shamela.ws/author/1532 and there is a possibilty that he may be going to be an emeritus professor of Islamic University, Kushtia by university authority as his age is now 65.202.134.11.243 (talk) 12:37, 30 May 2024 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Royalty and nobility-related deletion discussions. Willthacheerleader18 (talk) 14:29, 30 May 2024 (UTC)
- Keep: There is WP:GNG . Safari ScribeEdits! Talk! 07:52, 2 June 2024 (UTC)
- Delete - the WP:GNG requires significant coverage in independent and reliable sources. We haven't had anything offered which meets this standard in any language, so we can't WP:V the basics. Those who want to !keep cam of course rewrite thr page as/when they find acceptable sources. JMWt (talk) 05:58, 3 June 2024 (UTC)
- @JMWt Are you want to say that Offline Source is not acceptable? You should remain in WP:good Faith. ~ Deloar Akram (Talk • Contribute) 08:32, 3 June 2024 (UTC)
- Which offline source meets the standards of the GNG? I am remaining to assume Good Faith in the part of other contributors and don’t really see why you are suggesting otherwise. If there is an offline source that shows the importance of this person, which they’ve not written themselves, that I’ve missed then I’m happy to correct myself. JMWt (talk) 15:40, 3 June 2024 (UTC)
- @JMWt I mention my opinion in first comment. [Please see here]. ~ Deloar Akram (Talk • Contribute) 16:52, 3 June 2024 (UTC)
- Ok. Well, as others have already stated, being the author of university textbooks is not regarded as suitable notability for en.wiki
- I'm not saying that you are not offering an opinion in good faith, but I am saying that this is not a policy reason for !keep JMWt (talk) 17:18, 3 June 2024 (UTC)
- @JMWt I mention my opinion in first comment. [Please see here]. ~ Deloar Akram (Talk • Contribute) 16:52, 3 June 2024 (UTC)
- Which offline source meets the standards of the GNG? I am remaining to assume Good Faith in the part of other contributors and don’t really see why you are suggesting otherwise. If there is an offline source that shows the importance of this person, which they’ve not written themselves, that I’ve missed then I’m happy to correct myself. JMWt (talk) 15:40, 3 June 2024 (UTC)
- @JMWt Are you want to say that Offline Source is not acceptable? You should remain in WP:good Faith. ~ Deloar Akram (Talk • Contribute) 08:32, 3 June 2024 (UTC)
- 1 see here, his book about hinduism is highly praised in Zad TV by Muhammad al-Munajjid and the presenter also telephoned the publisher and requested hum to translate the book in English. His book Hindusiat wa Tasur was highly praised by Abdullah bin Salam al-Batati in the program "Al-Khajanah" of Zad TV owned by Muhammad Al-Munajjid and wished to be translated in English giving the book highly importance as a detailed work on Hinduism from the Islamic perspective.[1] His book Ash-Shirk fil-Qadim Wal Hadith has been partially translated into Indonesian by Abu Umamah Arif Hidayatullah as "Syirik pada Zaman Dahulu dan Sekarang".[2][3] Besides, the same translator also translated some of his other works into Indonesian language.[4] - 202.134.14.139 (talk) 16:28, 4 June 2024 (UTC)
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The result was delete. Liz Read! Talk! 05:35, 29 May 2024 (UTC)
- Kazi Shameem Farhad (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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Fails WP:GNG and possibly involve a COI. Vinegarymass911 (talk) 05:11, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Bangladesh-related deletion discussions. Vinegarymass911 (talk) 05:11, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
- delete - Agree with the nominator. -AlbeitPK (talk) 07:47, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Academics and educators and Military. WCQuidditch ☎ ✎ 10:51, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
- Delete per nom fails WP:GNG.Pharaoh of the Wizards (talk) 17:49, 26 May 2024 (UTC)
- delete No source is identified for any of the biographical information. The only sources cited are things he wrote, cited to prove that he wrote them, mostly newspaper columns and editorials. No source could be found containing more than a passing mention about him. --Worldbruce (talk) 06:02, 28 May 2024 (UTC)
- Strong Delete The person is nowhere to be found although the references in the article are also rubbish sources. Ontor22 (talk) 11:52, 28 May 2024 (UTC)
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The result was delete. Liz Read! Talk! 05:34, 29 May 2024 (UTC)
- Sabiha Mehzabin Oishee (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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There are no claims to notability, and nothing in the sources suggests subject passes WP:GNG. Vinegarymass911 (talk) 05:10, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Bangladesh-related deletion discussions. Vinegarymass911 (talk) 05:10, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
- delete - Fails WP:GNG. Can be a speedy deletion. -AlbeitPK (talk) 07:46, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Academics and educators, Businesspeople, and Women. WCQuidditch ☎ ✎ 10:51, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
- Delete per nom lacks coverage fails WP:GNG.Pharaoh of the Wizards (talk) 17:56, 26 May 2024 (UTC)
- Delete References are not appropriate-profiles and self-published sources. Did not established notability at all. Ontor22 (talk) 11:55, 28 May 2024 (UTC)
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The result was delete. Discarding canvassed votes and views not based on P&G, there is rough consensus to delete. Owen× ☎ 13:03, 29 June 2024 (UTC)
- Salman Muqtadir (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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Sources are trivial (included in a list of other youtubers) and non-independent. One significant coverage is about his investigation by the police. No other significant independent secondary source covering his popularity as a content creator. - AlbeitPK (talk) 01:51, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: People and Bangladesh. AlbeitPK (talk) 01:51, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Actors and filmmakers, Bands and musicians, Internet, and Australia. WCQuidditch ☎ ✎ 04:26, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
- Delete Most of the sources cover the police investigating him. That is not enough to satisfy WP:BIO. LibStar (talk) 17:42, 28 May 2024 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Given previous AFDs, not eligible for Soft Deletion. Have any sources mentioned in previous discussions been examined?
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz Read! Talk! 00:54, 29 May 2024 (UTC)
- Delete: An article that doesn't meet WP:ENT for inclusion on Wikipedia. While I couldn't find any clue in the former AFDs that I still hold deep breath of how it had survived two–three discussions. I am not going to base in any past whatsoever but here is the source analysis and final conclusion. source 1 is a primary source but it verifies the content as used in most of the articles like that per WP:PRIMARYSOURCE. Source 2 is good for sourcing but doesn't support the 'wife marriage'. source 3 is an obvious advert and interview making me suspect the credibility/reliability of source 2. Source 4 is unreliable, and source 5 looks like an advertorial unverifiable publication. Source 6, source 7, and source 8 contributes to a non notable controversy and I call it WP:BLP1E because the said event is not notable for a standalone article. [5] and [6] supports a non notable film and book, hence doesn't meet WP:NACTOR or WP:NAUTHOR. Safari ScribeEdits! Talk! 21:08, 29 May 2024 (UTC)
- Delete Not a notable person Md Joni Hossain (talk) 18:24, 30 May 2024 (UTC)
- Delete. Previously I nominated this article for Afd and my view still same. There is no WP:SIGCOV and fails WP:GNG. আফতাবুজ্জামান (talk) 21:56, 4 June 2024 (UTC)
- Keep Article has been improved and more reliable sources are added, such as The Daily Star or Prothom Alo. Popular national reliable newspapers claim that Salman Muqtadir is a popular YouTuber and actor and there are a bunch of sources about him from reliable sites. Although some news are about his marriage or other things but they are published independently about him and declared him as YouTuber, influencer or actor. Therefore GNG has been able to establish. Ontor22 (talk) 12:03, 6 June 2024 (UTC)
- The Daily star tag link you showed popped paid/sponsored articles [7], [8], [9], and [10]. They doesn't credibly means this article won't met notability later. See WP:LOTSOFSOURCES and know there isn't any amount of sources you add to a non notable person to be notable. On the aspect scene of YouTube, famous people are celebrities bur that doesn't mean try are notable. Safari ScribeEdits! Talk! 18:58, 7 June 2024 (UTC)
- News from The Daily Star are not paid or sponsored articles at all. Other news channels including Daily Star use disclaimers on sponsored articles but these are not. His marriage news appeared in multiple news channels.
- See his marriage news from Prothom alo, Dhaka Tribune, The Business Standard.
- Older articles about him also show his prominence.
- See these article from Prothom Alo 1 2, Bangla Tribune, The Business Standard, Jagonews24
- Salman Muktadir is not only YouTuber but also worked in various entertainment fields including television, stage performance which established his notability based on WP:ENT. Ontor22 (talk) 06:46, 14 June 2024 (UTC)
- The Daily star tag link you showed popped paid/sponsored articles [7], [8], [9], and [10]. They doesn't credibly means this article won't met notability later. See WP:LOTSOFSOURCES and know there isn't any amount of sources you add to a non notable person to be notable. On the aspect scene of YouTube, famous people are celebrities bur that doesn't mean try are notable. Safari ScribeEdits! Talk! 18:58, 7 June 2024 (UTC)
- Delete - He is notable on YouTube as an influencer & content creator. but doesn't meet WP:BIO or WP:ENT for inclusion on Wikipedia.--DelwarHossain (talk) 11:22, 18 June 2024 (UTC)
- Keep - He is notable person. I agree with Ontor22. Yubrajhn (talk) 19:30, 18 June 2024 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Procedural relist to rescue lost AfD. There's close to a consensus to delete here, but not something I'm comfortable closing as myself given the promises I made to stay out of using my admin tools for tricky content issues.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, * Pppery * it has begun... 20:09, 21 June 2024 (UTC)
- DELETE Not notable enough for Wikipedia standards. Jaunpurzada (talk) 00:16, 29 June 2024 (UTC)
- KEEP After four consecutive AFDs, the article mostly survives on Wikipedia. Still, there is a stir among editors. Mainly his being a YouTuber, but he has also worked in drama and music which makes him notable under WP:ENT. Mafmes (talk) 03:17, 29 June 2024 (UTC)
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The result was redirect to Sheikh Russel#In Popular Culture. Doczilla Ohhhhhh, no! 21:26, 4 June 2024 (UTC)
- Amader Choto Russel Shona (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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Lacks significant coverage in reliable Source. - AlbeitPK (talk) 17:22, 20 May 2024 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Film and Bangladesh. AlbeitPK (talk) 17:22, 20 May 2024 (UTC)
- Redirect to Sheikh_Russel#In_Popular_Culture: as alternative to deletion if coverage seems insufficient. -My, oh my! (Mushy Yank) 08:46, 21 May 2024 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, signed, Rosguill talk 16:47, 28 May 2024 (UTC)
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The result was keep. Doczilla Ohhhhhh, no! 21:25, 4 June 2024 (UTC)
- Sheikh Ahmadullah (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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Reference are self published, primary sources and promotional. These sources do not establish notability of the person. AlbeitPK (talk) 16:53, 20 May 2024 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: People, Islam, and Bangladesh. AlbeitPK (talk) 16:53, 20 May 2024 (UTC)
- Keep. Bangladeshi newspaper constantly covered significance news and column about Sheikh Ahmadullah. This proves that he has fulfilled WP:GNG. I suspect the removal proponent is aggressively trying to remove Ahmadullah and his organization's articles. Because in recent times he has proposed the removal of these two. And he didn't make any edits on the wiki other than these. ~ Deloar Akram (Talk • Contribute) 08:36, 21 May 2024 (UTC)
- Keep notable person. Md Joni Hossain (talk) 16:28, 23 May 2024 (UTC)
- Keep Independent and reliable sources are available. Ontor22 (talk) 11:44, 28 May 2024 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: While it has been variously asserted by nom and the current majority for keep that the sources do/don't establish GNG, there has been no discussion of individual sources that could move towards decisively substantiating such evaluations.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, signed, Rosguill talk 16:44, 28 May 2024 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Royalty and nobility-related deletion discussions. Willthacheerleader18 (talk) 14:29, 30 May 2024 (UTC)
- Keep [11] Kaler Kantho, [12] Jugantor, [13] Republic TV and many more notable, reliable and established news link can be presented about him. See google search [14] [15] [16] 202.134.11.243 (talk) 15:30, 30 May 2024 (UTC)
- Keep subject appears to meet WP:GNG. -- Willthacheerleader18 (talk) 15:04, 3 June 2024 (UTC)
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The result was soft delete. Based on minimal participation, this uncontroversial nomination is treated as an expired PROD (a.k.a. "soft deletion"). Editors can request the article's undeletion. ✗plicit 23:37, 27 May 2024 (UTC)
- As Sunnah Foundation (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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This article is written based on highly promotional, press releases and self published sources. Most of the sites are unreliable, some of them are recirculation of press releases, contain bank account information for collecting donations, some contain external links to the site of the organisation. I think the purpose of creation of this article is to promote the organisation. Topic of This article can be well explained in the article of the owner. Although I am not sure whether the owner's article warrants his own article or not. - AlbeitPK (talk) 16:44, 20 May 2024 (UTC)
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The result was delete. Complex/Rational 14:03, 3 June 2024 (UTC)
- Ahsan Akbar (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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Based on the previous AfD at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/The Devil's Thumbprint, I still do not think this passes WP:GNG or WP:BASIC. There is not enough SIGCOV in RSs to establish notability. Vanderwaalforces (talk) 10:19, 20 May 2024 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Authors, Poetry, Bangladesh, and United Kingdom. WCQuidditch ☎ ✎ 10:47, 20 May 2024 (UTC)
- Delete - Agree with the nominator. - AlbeitPK (talk) 16:56, 20 May 2024 (UTC)
- Keep - Clearly notable. Not just as a poet/columnist, but also as a successful cultural producer/entrepreneur whose literary festival is the biggest of its kind in one of the world's largest countries (at least three times bigger than the UK by population). Anglophones may or may not be aware of it, but that is utterly irrelevant to the Bangladesh-based popularity of Dhaka LitFest. --Peripatetic (talk) 12:22, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, ✗plicit 11:49, 27 May 2024 (UTC)
- Delete References appear to be not about him, notability not established; unclear why his role in Dhaka LitFest meets notability thresholds. Royal Autumn Crest (talk) 11:51, 27 May 2024 (UTC)
- Delete: Some sources are primary but I am sure there will notability in the future. Safari ScribeEdits! Talk! 07:46, 2 June 2024 (UTC)
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The result was delete. I will not draftify given the copyright concerns. Star Mississippi 01:29, 29 May 2024 (UTC)
- Devapāla's Campaigns against Pratiharas (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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A copy of the Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Pala invasion of Kannauj. Same content, fails WP:GNG, poorly found in reliable sources. Part of Tripartite struggle, can be added to it. Imperial[AFCND] 14:50, 6 May 2024 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Events, History, Military, Bangladesh, and India. Imperial[AFCND] 14:50, 6 May 2024 (UTC)
- Keep Not even a single thing here is copied from Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Pala invasion of Kannauj. That article was about Dharmapal's invasion of Kannauj and this article is about Devapal's campaign against the Pratiharas, Plus this has nothing to do with the Tripartite Struggle and this definitely doesn't fail WP:GNG. All of the sources cited here are completely reliable.
- Based Kashmiri (talk) 15:00, 6 May 2024 (UTC)
- No results for "Devapāla's Campaigns against Pratiharas" in Google scholar, JSTOR [17], and literally zero result from Google keyword searching. Hardly found few sources (including what present in the article), that barely mentioned no more than two or three lines about the so called "Campaign". And passes GNG? See WP:SIGCOV. Imperial[AFCND] 15:11, 6 May 2024 (UTC)
- This article is very notable and has been given significant coverage in reliable sources therefore it passes WP:GNG and WP:SIGCOV.
The Gurjara lords against whom Devapāla fought must have been the Pratīhāra rulers. It is possible that Nagabhața II tried to assert his power after the death of Dharmapāla and if, as some scholars believe, he transferred his capital to Kanauj, he must have achieved some success. But Devapāla soon re-established the Pala supremacy, and it was possibly after his (Devapāla's) successful campaign against the Pratihāras that he advanced to the Hūņa and Kamboja princi- palities. Nāgabhața's son, Ramabhadra, probably also had his kingdom invaded by Devapāla. The next Pratihāra king Bhoja also, in spite of his initial success, suffered reverses at the hands of Devapāla, and could not restore the fortunes of his family so long as the Pala emperor was alive. Thus Devapāla successfully fought with three generations of Pratihāra rulers, and maintained the Pala supremacy in Northern India.
[1][2]
- Based Kashmiri (talk) 15:56, 6 May 2024 (UTC)
- "It is notable because I said so." Industrial Insect (talk) 18:18, 6 May 2024 (UTC)
- Ignore WP:RS which has significant coverage about the topic of the article and just say "It is notable because I said so.", wow.
The article is notable for several reasons. First, it has significant coverage from WP:RS. Second, It passes WP:GNG and WP:SIGCOV. I hope this helps clarify why the article meets the notability criteria. Based Kashmiri (talk) 03:55, 7 May 2024 (UTC)
- Ignore WP:RS which has significant coverage about the topic of the article and just say "It is notable because I said so.", wow.
- "It is notable because I said so." Industrial Insect (talk) 18:18, 6 May 2024 (UTC)
- No results for "Devapāla's Campaigns against Pratiharas" in Google scholar, JSTOR [17], and literally zero result from Google keyword searching. Hardly found few sources (including what present in the article), that barely mentioned no more than two or three lines about the so called "Campaign". And passes GNG? See WP:SIGCOV. Imperial[AFCND] 15:11, 6 May 2024 (UTC)
- Keep the article appears to be successfully meet the criteria set forth in Wikipedia's Notability guidelines and the issues raised in the nomination do not appear to be evident within the article itself.
- Khotanese26 (talk) 10:11, 8 May 2024 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz Read! Talk! 20:50, 13 May 2024 (UTC)- Delete Two mundane keep votes so far, one from the creator and another from a very new user (?!). For my money, I'd say to delete, as the sources presented in the article, and with my own lookups, led to nothing of substantial use that can justify a rigid keep. X (talk) 07:58, 16 May 2024 (UTC)
References
- ^ Majumdar, R. C. (2009). History and Culture of the Indian People, Volume 04, The Age Of Imperial Kanauj. Public Resource. Bharatiya Vidya Bhavan. pp. 50–51.
- ^ Others, Muzaffar H. Syed & (2022-02-20). History of Indian Nation : Ancient India. K.K. Publications. p. 287.
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Keep or delete?
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, CycloneYoris talk! 03:43, 21 May 2024 (UTC)
- Delete Only found 2,3 lines about this article in the referenced sources. The author is using words like Possibly and we are not keeping the article which is not definite abt the information, Secondly the editor of this article doing his interpretation and adding headings like devpala conflict with X, devpala conflict with y which is not even in the sources.Violetmyers (talk) 07:24, 26 May 2024 (UTC)
- Note to closer: I think I can improve this article based on the concern raised in this discussion, let me work on this article further. I'd request the closer to please draftify it so I can improve this article. Based.Kashmiri (🗨️) 04:32, 27 May 2024 (UTC)
- Copyright Problems: Due to multiple occurrences of of close paraphrasing, particularly in the lead, I have sent the article to copyright problems. I was originally just going to remove the offending material and make a note of which sources I removed here, so here's a link to the one I removed before realizing the extent of the issues. GreenLipstickLesbian (talk) 23:00, 27 May 2024 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was no consensus. Arbitrarily0 (talk) 21:05, 26 May 2024 (UTC)
- Gauda–Gupta War (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
- (Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
If the article focuses solely on the conflicts between the Gauda kingdom and the Guptas, it lacks WP:RS and historians do not consider these mutual campaigns as a single state of war, known as the "Gauda—Gupta War(s)". If we include the mutual conflicts between the Guptas and Gaudas in the article's scope, it becomes a result of original research and the synthesis of multiple conflicts. The conflicts involving Ishanavarman, Jivitagupta I, and Gopachandra are mentioned, but figures such as Kumaragupta III, Dharmaditya, and Samacharadeva are not addressed in the War section, but in the infobox. Upon reviewing the sources, authors are uncertain about the statements, with a weak consensus. In essence, the article combines non-notable military conflicts, cited by low-quality sources, involving different kingdoms—the Maukhari dynasty and the Later Gupta dynasty—against the Gauda kingdom, and labels it as the "Gauda—Gupta War". It adds minor conflicts to create the impression of significance, which is not justified. The article fails to meet GNG and contains original research. There are significant issues to address, AFD is limiting the discourse. Imperial[AFCND] 13:15, 2 May 2024 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: History, Military, Bangladesh, and India. Imperial[AFCND] 13:15, 2 May 2024 (UTC)
- Keep @ImperialAficionado There's no synthesis and OR, every cited source comes to the conclusion that Maukharis and later Guptas fought against Gaudas on behalf of the Gupta emperor.
It's quite likely that the war of Ishanavarman against the Gaudas whom he had forced to take shelter on the sea shore and the victory of Jivitagupta I over the enemies who stood on the sea-shore, refer to the expeditions launched by the Maukharis and the Later Guptas, separately or jointly, against the kings of Bengal discussed above who had declared their independence of the empire and had assumed the imperial title. Probably, the Maukhari and the Later Gupta rulers undertook these campaigns in the name of the Gupta emperor who was their nominal overlord, though their success increased their own power, and not of the emperor.
From Goyal (1967).
The people of Gauda (W. Bengal) also achieved prominence, and a Maukhari chief claims to have defeated them. The Later Guptas also fought against some enemies who lived on the sea-shore. The reference in both cases may be to the kings of Bengal mentioned above, and the military campaigns of the Maukharis and the Later Guptas might have been undertaken, jointly or severally, on behalf of the Gupta emperor, their nominal overlord.
Majumdar (1970).
- Quoting these two should be enough. The other sources are right there, you should have thoroughly verified it before proposing AFD for this article. According to nom it's cited with low quality sources seriously? As far as I know the works of S.R. Goyal, R.C. Majumdar, K.K Dasgupta, H.K Barpujari and others are qualitatively reliable. If nom has any doubt for the cited sources then they should verify those at RSN.— Preceding unsigned comment added by Jonharojjashi (talk • contribs)
- @Jonharojjashi,
cited with low quality sources
is referring my earlier statement in the proposalauthors are uncertain about the statements, with a weak consensus
, take the time to read the whole proposal reason. The weakness of the statements from the sources are evident from the above quotes, presented by yourself above.It's quite likely that...Probably, the Maukhari and the Later Gupta rulers un...
from Goyal andThe reference in both cases may be to the kings of Bengal mentioned above...and the Later Guptas might have been undertaken, jointly or
from Majumdar. Keeping this weak statements aside, surprisingly I couldn't find any latest records about the event(s).--Imperial[AFCND] 17:05, 2 May 2024 (UTC) - If that's the issue then the article body should reflect the sources whether they have "weak consensus" or not. And that is what I have done in The War section. From what I have seen, many articles are made after being based on even less consensus, like Sasanian–Kushan Wars, you should also see my question regarding this at the help desk [18], and here the sources do say "possibly" so I can do the same in Infobox and article body (basically I'm reflecting what the sources say). Again I don't get what the problem is, just because sources hold weak consensus thus they are of low quality? And you didn't answer where does it contains synthesis and OR. Looks like you didn't even read the article and verify it with the cited sources and stuck to the possilikely words. -- Jonharojjashi (talk) 16:22, 3 May 2024 (UTC)
- Dear. That's why I said
AFD is limiting the discourse
, I need a bigger space to expose the whole mess within the article. And no need to drag Sasanian–Kushan Wars here. Take that to the respective talk section if you have any problem with it. Imperial[AFCND] 17:25, 3 May 2024 (UTC)- No that should not be a reason, AFD is what exactly for highlighting all the cons of the article, there's no limiting discourse. Just say you can't show where this article contains synthesis, OR and weak sources. You're free to expose any drawbacks of this page. There's no need to be in the grey area. I'd assume that you're either procrastinating or failing to prove your points.
- I'm not dragging Sasanian–Kushan Wars here instead, I cleared your doubts regarding "weak consensus" through it. Don't just throw away it by saying no need to drag.
- For other voters: Note that there's an AFD discussion going on their own page [19] and also note that the nom hasn't clearly provided anything to show this article holds any OR, synthesis and weak sources. Jonharojjashi (talk) 01:53, 4 May 2024 (UTC)
- Dear. That's why I said
- @Jonharojjashi,
- Delete Another WP:SYNTH mess. --HistoryofIran (talk) 19:17, 2 May 2024 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Owen× ☎ 20:19, 10 May 2024 (UTC)
- Keep. Two reliable sources that I can verify the content on the page are from historians R. C. Majumdar and K.K. Dasgupta. Some other sources though are from historians like Sailendra Nath Sen but I can not verify them. Taking the two reliable sources that help with verification, I feel this page passes the general notability guidelines. RangersRus (talk) 13:09, 17 May 2024 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Delete or keep?
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, CycloneYoris talk! 09:58, 18 May 2024 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.