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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. MBisanz talk 21:48, 13 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Creative Disc

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Creative Disc (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log · Stats)
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I can't find any indication that this weblog (and its group of associated chart articles) are sufficiently notable to warrant inclusion in Wikipedia. It describes itself as a music blog, and I can't find any references to it in reliable sources. It includes pirated copies of Billboard charts (see links like http://creativedisc.com/top-charts/billboard-hot-100-singles/billboard-hot-rb-hip-hop-songs-19-mar/ ) which makes it even less likely that this is a reliable charting agency. —Kww(talk) 01:42, 4 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Indonesia-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 17:43, 4 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This debate has been included in the list of Music-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 17:43, 4 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This debate has been included in the list of Websites-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 17:43, 4 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This debate has been included in the list of Lists-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 17:44, 4 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete - Not notable, no reliable sources. I'm not even sure Indonesia has a national chart... certainly not one that's been around for as long as Billboard... — Crisco 1492 (talk) 05:41, 6 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete The only sources are from the website itself and we are not being honest with our readers that the only sources have conflict of interest per Wikipedia:Third-party sources#Non-independent sources. The subject does not seem to be notable. Per lack of independent reliable secondary sources to stabilish notability. Algébrico (talk) 13:11, 7 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Strong Keep the blog seems to be doing exactly what it purports to. It compiles music charts in Indonesia, plus a few from around the world (like Billboard's). But mainly, the chart seems to be compiled from the individual lists of the radio stations in Indonesia. Now, none of that would matter, except we don't have another source of music charts in Indonesia, the fourth largest nation in the world by population. (See List of record charts)
    Their main chart is not pirated. This week's number one is Fall Out Boy's My Songs Know What You Did in the Dark. It has not been number one on Billboard, nor in the UK [[1]], but, if you look at the radios station charts on the page you find that it is huge in Indonesia.Listmeister (talk) 22:02, 9 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • I didn't claim that their main chart was pirated, only that the site included pirated charts. There are numerous countries that we don't have reliable charts for, and we haven't made a practice of including blogs simply because we had no other source.—Kww(talk) 22:16, 9 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • How do you know it was pirated? Maybe they have an arrangement with Billboard. Do a Google Search on ' "Creative Disc" Indonesia ' and you get 28,000 hits. After the first 10 which are the usual Wikipedia and Facebook hits, you get page after page of "[Name of Artist] number one in Indonesia, according to CreativeDisc. "[Another artist] interview with Creative Disc." "[Song] highest debuting single on Indonesia's Creative Disc." It looks to me like this site is the industry's representative in Indonesia. Listmeister (talk) 16:08, 10 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Nobody has that arrangement with Billboard. Not even Billboard.com has that arrangement with Billboard. No licensee can reprint an entire chart verbatim. Certainly I looked at the Google results. Care to share which ones of those subsequent links represent reliable sources? All I saw was blogs and fansites, and none of the other people in this discussion reported finding a reliable source either.—Kww(talk) 20:41, 10 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • If the fansites and blogs are equating 'Number One in Indonesia' with 'Number One on Creative Disc's Top 50', does not that indicate that Creative Disc is the national chart for Indonesia? And therefore, notable enough to warrant an article? I'll agree that one fansite or blog may not indicate Notability, but the cumulative weight of thousands of them indicates Notability. Listmeister (talk) 13:49, 11 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Only references from reliable sources count in determining whether something is a reliable source.—Kww(talk) 15:26, 11 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Reliability is not an all-or-nothing equation. If one website with a reliability quotient of .01 says something, okay, that's not reliable enough. If a thousand independent websites with a reliability of .01 say the same thing, that adds up to reliability level of 10, which equals a reasonable level of reliability. Now, if 1,000 fan sites say something like "Jay-Z = Awesome", clearly that's not good enough for the encyclopedia; but if they all say Jay-Z was born in New York City, weight be shear numbers would lead credence to the factuality of it. But if they all say that New York City is the biggest city in the United States, when the blog isn't really about New York City or the United States, that sounds like a pretty well established fact to me. These aren't blogs about Indonesian music charts or fansites of CreativeCD, these are sites about artists that mention, in passing, the fact that CreativeCD is the national music chart for Indonesia.Listmeister (talk) 13:38, 12 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete. The blog cannot serve as a source supporting its own notability, and all given sources go back to the blog itself. MezzoMezzo (talk) 07:03, 13 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
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