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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. Aoidh (talk) 01:36, 15 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Georgios Ermidis

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Georgios Ermidis (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log | edits since nomination)
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Repeatedly recreated article. Ermidis is a non-notable semi-pro footballer who, to date, has played in a friendly for FC Desna Chernihiv, a few youth matches and 2 minutes in the Russian third tier. The article gives the illusion of notability by using the WP:REFBOMB tactic; flooding the article with references to stats pages, non-independent sources and trivial mentions. WP:SPORTBASIC requires multiple WP:RS independent of Ermidis showing detailed coverage. This wasn't met in the old versions of this article and this new version still doesn't meet it. Searching "Георгіос Ермеідіс" and "Γεώργιος Ερμίδης" yielded nothing better.

Given the huge number of sources, I will do a source analysis to explain why each one does not confer notability. Spiderone(Talk to Spider) 21:37, 7 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Source assessment table:
Source Independent? Reliable? Significant coverage? Count source toward GNG?
http://fczt-oz.ru/player/georgij-ermidi/ No Website for his current employer No No No info ✘ No
https://sports3.teliaco.gr/oykrania-petaxan-proedro-mesa-se-kado-aporrimmaton-vid/ Yes Yes No Mentioned once ✘ No
https://www.footballdatabase.eu/es/jugador/detalles/437568-georgios-ermidis No No No Stats ✘ No
https://upl.ua/ua/people/view/66778?id=66778 No No No Stats ✘ No
https://www.desna.football/georgios-ermeidis-mi-vse-doveli-na-futbolnomu-poli/ No Desna was his employer No No Basic Q&A with no independent content ✘ No
https://www.desna.football/georgios-ermeidis-v-gretsiyi-znayut-shho-ukrayinskij-futbol-dosit-silnij/ No Desna was his employer No No Basic Q&A with no independent content ✘ No
https://www.ua-football.com/ukrainian/high/1602004469-desna-zayavila-na-upl-grecheskogo-poluzaschitnika.html Yes Yes No Basic transfer announcement with no in-depth coverage ✘ No
https://goldtalant.com.ua/?p=115256 Yes Yes No Basic transfer announcement with no in-depth coverage ✘ No
https://goldtalant.com.ua/?p=118907 Yes Yes No Mentioned once ✘ No
http://footballfan.net.ua/news/ukraina/georgios-ermeidis-popolnil-ryady-desny ? ? ? Inaccessible for me ? Unknown
https://globalsportsarchive.com/people/soccer/georgios-ermeidis/432422/ No No No Stats ✘ No
https://fcvorskla.com.ua/players/18175/ No No No Stats ✘ No
https://upl.ua/ua/people/view/66778?season=31 No No No Stats ✘ No
https://cheline.com.ua/news/sport/desna-vigrala-u-tovariskomu-matchi-iz-olimpikom-280741 Yes Yes No Not mentioned ✘ No
https://www.ua-football.com/ukrainian/high/1636969576-desna-provedet-tovarischeskiy-match-s-olimpikom.html Yes Yes No Not mentioned ✘ No
https://www.desna.football/tm-fk-chernigiv-desna-perevirili-molod/ No Desna was his employer No No Mentioned twice in the main report ✘ No
https://suspilne.media/206151-desna-viletila-na-zbir-do-tureccini-hto-v-skladi-komandi/ Yes Yes No Mentioned once ✘ No
https://www.chesport.cn.ua/2022/02/15/desna-zigrala-pershyj-match-na-zborah-u-turechchyni-arveladze-zabyv-gol-krasen/ Yes Yes No Squad list mention ✘ No
https://www.ua-football.com/ukrainian/high/1645125893-desna-na-sborah-obygrala-gruzinskoe-torpedo.html Yes Yes No Mentioned once ✘ No
https://www.ua-football.com/ukrainian/first/1645367256-krivbass-v-sparringe-ustupil-desne.html Yes Yes No Not mentioned ✘ No
http://fczt-oz.ru/2023/03/24/georgij-ermidi-novichok-znameni-truda/ No His employer No No Barely any detail - date of birth and previous clubs ✘ No
http://fczt-oz.ru/2023/04/03/vazhnaya-pobeda/ No His employer No No Squad list mention ✘ No
https://int.soccerway.com/matches/2023/04/03/russia/2-division/elektron-vn/znamya-truda-orekhovo-zuyevo/4061291/ No No No Stats ✘ No
https://int.soccerway.com/players/georgios-ermidis/675125// No No No Stats ✘ No
This table may not be a final or consensus view; it may summarize developing consensus, or reflect assessments of a single editor. Created using {{source assess table}}.
Spiderone(Talk to Spider) 21:52, 7 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Hello I am point out that some Independent sources were marked as incorrectly but they are correct. In particular the souce http://fczt-oz.ru/2023/03/24/georgij-ermidi-novichok-znameni-truda/ you marked incorrectly as HIS EMPLOYER, but the guy has been hired but the club in Russian Second League and he has already played one match. The souce https://int.soccerway.com/matches/2023/04/03/russia/2-division/elektron-vn/znamya-truda-orekhovo-zuyevo/4061291/ and https://int.soccerway.com/players/georgios-ermidis/675125// as the official website that I've added, prove that they genuine evidence that the player was hired by https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FC_Znamya_Truda_Orekhovo-Zuyevo Iliochori2 (talk) 06:35, 8 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]
FC Znamya Truda Orekhovo-Zuyevo is his current employer as per the article that you yourself have written so I am correct to label as such. He is employed by them and you yourself have admitted above that he has even played one match (or 2 minutes of one match) for them!! Anything that his club publishes about him is non-independent by definition. Spiderone(Talk to Spider) 10:11, 8 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Regarding the souce https://goldtalant.com.ua/?p=118907 wasn't mentioned once but more than one time Iliochori2 (talk) 07:07, 8 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]
He is mentioned only once in the main prose. Even if we count the squad list mention at the bottom as coverage, that's still only two mentions in a whole article, which is not WP:SIGCOV. Spiderone(Talk to Spider) 10:11, 8 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]
He is not mentioned only once but more and there are genuine sources. Iliochori2 (talk) 17:47, 8 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]
@GiantSnowman: - I've pinged GS for you, Iliochori2. I'll give my reasons as to why these 4 sources are not acceptable for WP:SPORTBASIC. Soccerway is a stats page, this type of source does not show significant coverage and SPORTBASIC is very clear about this. FCZT is hosted by his employer and also contains zero useful info about the footballer. Tribuna is 3 sentences about him and admits to using Transfermarkt as a source, which is unacceptable per WP:TRANSFERMARKT. Val mentions him once in a list of players attending a training camp! None of these sources are even close to significant. For significant coverage, I expect to see several paragraphs written about the player from an independent party, as an absolute minimum. Spiderone(Talk to Spider) 22:37, 8 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Yeah these are just databases and trivial pieces, some of them questionable. GiantSnowman 07:48, 9 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Yes but some of them really show genuine sources Iliochori2 (talk) 19:04, 9 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Nobody is saying that they aren't genuine. The problem is that every single source that has been discussed is just a trivial mention or a stats database. Where are the reliable & independent news sources that have paragraphs of prose dedicated to Ermidis? None have been brought forward. Spiderone(Talk to Spider) 21:52, 9 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Of course you have lot experience regarding the sources to be included on wikipeda. At the same time I am sure that the sources https://ua.tribuna.com/football/1089729130-desna-zayavila-19-letnego-grecheskogo-xavbeka-ermeidisa/ and https://int.soccerway.com/players/georgios -ermidis/675125//, https://val.ua/ru/site/129072 and especially http://fczt-oz.ru/2023/03/24/georgij-ermidi-novichok-znameni-truda/ being the team's official website, are evidence to show that the player's trustworthiness. Iliochori2 (talk) 10:18, 10 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]
You're missing the point. Ermidis exists. If that's the point that you are making then I agree. The point that I'm trying to get across is that Ermidis is not notable because nobody has written at length about him. For example, there are no lengthy articles dedicated to him nor are there news articles with multiple paragraphs of coverage all dedicated to Ermidis. Please stop posting the same trivial mentions and familiarise yourself with the guidelines including WP:N, WP:SPORTBASIC, WP:GNG and WP:BIO. Spiderone(Talk to Spider) 15:47, 10 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, I getting the point, I think I'm not posting the trivial mentions themselves, and I'm familiarizing myself with Wikipedia's guidelines. I agree that there are no long articles dedicated to him, but there are reliable statistics and also quite reliable resources. Iliochori2 (talk) 15:56, 10 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]
It's the fact that there are no long articles dedicated to him, like you say, that is the issue not whether the statistics are reliable or not. Spiderone(Talk to Spider) 19:55, 12 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I understand, but statistics are not reliable enough? Iliochori2 (talk) 20:20, 12 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Reliability is not the issue. It's that there is no significant coverage. I have already stated this several times now. Also per WP:SPORTBASIC Sports biographies must include at least one reference to a source providing significant coverage of the subject, excluding database sources. This comprehensively fails that requirement. Spiderone(Talk to Spider) 17:59, 13 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I understand Iliochori2 (talk) 13:52, 14 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you for your understanding. If I may offer you advice, you clearly are working very hard on trying to improve the project but sometimes spending too much time on really minor and non-notable footballers. There are plenty of very notable Ukrainian footballers for whom many sources exist but our Wikipedia articles could be better sourced, for example Serhiy Rebrov, Andriy Shevchenko, Yevhen Konoplyanka... If you put that level of effort into improving articles like those then you will benefit the project even further as these are articles that people are much more likely to be interested in. Spiderone(Talk to Spider) 18:57, 14 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
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