Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/List of games with ray tracing support

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. Vanamonde (Talk) 19:39, 19 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

List of games with ray tracing support

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Unreferenced list with no assertion of notability. Why is it significant that a game has ray-tracing, a technique that comes standard on modern GPUs and is getting more common by the day? Without an affirmative answer to this question, this falls under WP:NOTDIR. This is not a defining feature of video games that warrants a list. Axem Titanium (talk) 04:53, 12 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Video games-related deletion discussions. Axem Titanium (talk) 04:53, 12 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Lists-related deletion discussions. Axem Titanium (talk) 04:53, 12 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Delete Too common and trivial to be a defining trait. This goes pretty much without saying. The list is also mostly unsourced, with some of the few references not even mentioning ray tracing. –LaundryPizza03 (d c̄) 05:06, 12 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

*Delete An article created a year before this one was deleted Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Games with ray tracing. I did a full history export to https://list.fandom.com/wiki/List_of_games_with_ray_tracing Anyway, this was once a notable feature when it first came out, ample coverage was found in the previous AFD talking about it, but now its rather common so not a defining feature. Dream Focus 05:47, 12 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

- Thanks for bringing up the previous discussion, Dream Focus. I was not aware that this has been litigated before. I don't know if this is a substantial recreation of the previous list or not. Axem Titanium (talk) 02:17, 13 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I find your logic here truly troubling. It is true that ray-tracing hardware comes standard on modern GPUs. However, just because the hardware comes standard does not make it a standard feature in software. In fact, the vast majority of all games released in a given time-frame do not support ray-tracing in any way. As far as notability goes, I think I have already laid out the foundation of why it is notable: it is not a standard feature in software as you appear to claim it to be. I also do not see how this falls under any of the of the points listed on the WP:NOTDIR page, so please enlighten me as to which specific point this page violates, and exactly how it violates that point. Svetroid (talk) 01:39, 13 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

(ec) Wikipedia is not a product catalogue. We are not here to advertise or sell games or GPUs based on the promise of a feature. "It's not a standard feature" is not an assertion of notability (please reread WP:LISTN and WP:SAL). Given that it's now a hardware standard, one might argue that lack of ray tracing support is more notable for a newly released game, but surely you wouldn't advocate for "List of games without ray tracing support", would you? Axem Titanium (talk) 02:17, 13 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

You seem to be basing the notability of ray-tracing on yourself simply saying it's not notable. You ignored my argument differentiating hardware and software support for ray-tracing, and then said "actually, lack of support for ray-tracing is more notable". Do I need to gather a list of all of the thousands of games released this year, and then show you the dozen that support ray-tracing to show you that it is notable? Are you next going to arbitrarily restrict what category of games we're talking about to try to make ray-tracing games look more numerous than they actually are for the sake of your notability argument? Additionally, making a list of games that support potentially different implementations of a hardware feature is not in any way, shape, or form advertising GPUs or games, and I find it ridiculous that you'd try to imply that. Svetroid (talk) 04:22, 13 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I agree with Svetroid. If games with support for hardware accelerated ray tracing were actually as common as some here claim, then this list would be miles long. Only AMD's latest generation Radeons and NVIDIA's current- and last-gen GeForces support the feature. I reference this page fairly regularly, as a journalist, and benchmarker. The only issue I can really see is the lack of sources in places. In some cases, that seems to be because the game developer doesn't do much highlighting of the feature itself, making a list like this all the more useful (assuming people are not adding titles they are not 100% certain about). Deathspawner (talk) 02:07, 13 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Delete Recreation of a previously deleted list, where consensus amongst numerous regulars of WP:VG is that it fell under WP:INDISCRIMINATE. Ray tracing is simply not a defining aspect of a video game. I sympathize with those who find the list a useful tool, but merely being interesting is not grounds for remaining on Wikipedia and this seems more fitting for some off site Wiki._{ZXCVBNM (TALK)} 06:05, 13 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Keep Over two years go by, and games with ray tracing still get coverage for that. https://www.digitaltrends.com/computing/games-support-nvidia-ray-tracing/ shows 31 games out now with 14 coming later on. That's just the Nvidia’s RTX ray tracing, not ray tracing done by others. Find a review for a single game that has it, and the reviewer always mentions how good that game looks with the ray tracing. It is a notable aspect because reviewers always mention it in reliable sources. No matter how long the list gets, as long as reviewers are still mentioning this key aspect of the game, then its notable. Dream Focus 06:09, 13 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]
I believe that in the previous AfD it was already stated that a prose article about the history of raytracing in video games would likely be notable, but a list article would just be a directory. Furthermore, the article is almost guaranteed to be deleted at some point in the future when pretty much all new 3D games have raytracing due to graphics cards getting more powerful, making it pointless to maintain. Notable articles should be notable forever, not conditional to a certain span of time._{ZXCVBNM (TALK)} 06:12, 13 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Its been notable for over two years now. If things ever change, then you can send it to AFD again. Right now it is notable. And this is not a directory but a valid navigational list, it listing information that someone looking for games that use ray tracing, would find quite useful to help them navigate to an article of interest to them. Also a valid information list for those who want to see how many are using this feature. Dream Focus 06:38, 13 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per WP:NOTDIR and WP:INDISCRIMINATE. Sergecross73 msg me 16:23, 13 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Delete Agree that it is trivial. Orientls (talk) 18:06, 13 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.